Does this count for wagon wednesday, or is it too Toyota Beige?

"BoxerFanatic, troublesome iconoclast." (boxerfanatic)
11/20/2013 at 14:09 • Filed to: Wagon Wednesday, Toyota, Venza, AS-V, Five-Axis, SEMA, 2008

5-Axis tuned Toyota Venza AS-V Wagon/CUV/5-door thingy. publicity car at 2008 SEMA show.

DISCUSSION (23)

Hoccy > BoxerFanatic, troublesome iconoclast.
11/20/2013 at 14:12

Too big and tall to be a wagon in my book. Toyota makes several wagons though, but this isn't one of them.

BoumboQC > BoxerFanatic, troublesome iconoclast.
11/20/2013 at 14:12

Wheels look nice.

Bob Loblaw Made Me Make a Phoney Phone Call to Edward Rooney > BoxerFanatic, troublesome iconoclast.
11/20/2013 at 14:14

Oh god I kind of like it. Front fogs need to go, though.

BoxerFanatic, troublesome iconoclast. > Hoccy
11/20/2013 at 14:15

Just out of curiosity, then, what would you classify it as?

And, would you count an Audi Allroad Avant, or a 2010+ bigger-sized Subaru Outback as a wagon? Granted, the current/new A4-based all road is smaller than this, and it's previous A6 Avant based Allroad.

RotaryLover > BoxerFanatic, troublesome iconoclast.
11/20/2013 at 14:15

I love the Toyota Venza, I have no regrets.

Spaceball-Two > BoxerFanatic, troublesome iconoclast.
11/20/2013 at 14:18

Beige. I see what you did there.

BoxerFanatic, troublesome iconoclast. > Spaceball-Two
11/20/2013 at 14:21

Yeah, I am not sure if it was coincidental, supposed to be ironic, or intentional that Five-Axis made this car beige and bronze two-tone, with Toyota's reputation associated with the color beige.

Jagvar > BoxerFanatic, troublesome iconoclast.
11/20/2013 at 14:25

Whatever they did to it, I hope they seriously improved the ride and handling, because the stock Venza I had for a day drove like a turd.

BoxerFanatic, troublesome iconoclast. > Jagvar
11/20/2013 at 14:28

Are you sure it was stock, and didn't have toyota accessory parts on it? ;->

killerkoolaid37 > BoxerFanatic, troublesome iconoclast.
11/20/2013 at 14:29

I'd classify it as a Crossover SUV myself.

Hoccy > BoxerFanatic, troublesome iconoclast.
11/20/2013 at 14:31

Something like a crossover or SUV. I don't really know what to compare it with (we don't get cars like this here), but I've seen one and it doesn't compare to a wagon.

Yes, I would. They are based on wagons, the interior is the same and they're only slightly taller and wider than the regular wagons. Same goes for the XC70, Octavia Scout, Passat Alltrack, Insignia Crosstour and all the others.

BoxerFanatic, troublesome iconoclast. > killerkoolaid37
11/20/2013 at 14:32

Yeah, due to the ride-height, I would, too.

But I have to say the sport-wagonish roofline (occurs to me to be slightly similar to the CTS wagon's roofline) does better than the Honda Crosstour on a car this size, and with said ride-height, for not being a boxy CUV/SUV. Probably significantly more cargo practicality than Crosstour/ZDX/BMW X6, too.

BoxerFanatic, troublesome iconoclast. > Hoccy
11/20/2013 at 14:36

Last I heard, Venza was based on the common platform between Camry, Avalon, and Highlander.

One could argue that it is half Avalon wagon, half 5-passenger down-sized Highlander...

Or a Toyota branded and re-styled alternative to the Lexus RX...

But, yeah, I would tend to call it a crossover vehicle... it crosses over pretty much all classifications... 5-door sedan, wagon, CUV...

philaDLJ > BoxerFanatic, troublesome iconoclast.
11/20/2013 at 14:41

Kinja'd!!!

I'll allow it.

Makoyouidiot > BoxerFanatic, troublesome iconoclast.
11/20/2013 at 14:57

I lol'ed. Because it's on a golf course.

MIATAAAA > BoxerFanatic, troublesome iconoclast.
11/20/2013 at 15:00

This is less horrible than a regular Venza.

BoxerFanatic, troublesome iconoclast. > MIATAAAA
11/20/2013 at 15:19

Is a Venza specifically horrible, or just a part of a horrible genre of vehicles not in the same part of the automotive spectrum as a Miata?

MIATAAAA > BoxerFanatic, troublesome iconoclast.
11/20/2013 at 15:29

Oh I love all types of cars!

But the Venza is for people who really want a crossover, but really want a Camry.

If I wanted a car that handled like the Venza, I'd drive a blimp.

BoxerFanatic, troublesome iconoclast. > MIATAAAA
11/20/2013 at 15:54

I would have figured someone who wanted a vehicle like that, and I group Outback, and Audi Allroad, and such with it...

as something shy of a 2-ton+ behemoth, with a combination of useable ground clearance and manageable center of gravity, maybe a little bit less aero resistance than a cement block, and only as much vehicle weight as practically necessary.

I have to say, I don't hate these vehicles, and for less than 4+ grown people in the car almost all the time, or lots of cargo and towing weight capacity needed... these vehicles make more sense to me than one or two people driving around in perennially empty and un-loaded full size truck-based SUVs, like a Suburban or something. But to each their own.

I have a Miata myself, and I know the appeal of small light cars, but they can't carry or tow anything at all, and they get noisy and cramped on longer trips, especially in less than great weather. And the roads that are only getting more neglected beat up little light-weight low-riding cars, and the people riding in them.

Somehow purity of handling doesn't really come into it much. Not every car can be pure, and impractical.

Maybe I have just been hammered by a rough-riding performance car (lowered Subaru) over rough and worsening pavement for too long. Smooth sounds good to me, and some moderate/modest ground clearance might not be too bad.

Not that I would ever give up a Miata for this class of vehicle... it would be 'in addition to..."

MIATAAAA > BoxerFanatic, troublesome iconoclast.
11/20/2013 at 16:06

I don't disagree, but we're talking about the Venza. Not crossovers.

Get an Outback by all means! It's a great car! The Allroad is fantastic!

The Venza is not.

It's not more practical that other crossovers. It's not better looking than other crossovers (debatable, I suppose). It's not cheaper than a lot of other crossovers. It doesn't handle better than other crossovers.

It doesn't do anything better (and often does things worse) than most, if not all, other crossovers.

Crossover fail.

Get an Outback. Or an Edge. Or a CX-5. Or a CX-9. Or a CRV. Or a Forester.

BoxerFanatic, troublesome iconoclast. > MIATAAAA
11/20/2013 at 16:31

Outbacks before 2009, especially H6s, are extremely rare. 2010-current is one of the worst looking vehicles in it's class, and while the drivetrain is very good, the amenities are lean compared to most. Tribecas mostly too, and are 4-600lbs heavier, with the same 16 gallon tank.

Great drivetrain... but the rest of the car could be more competitive on amenities and looks.

Allroads are expensive. Most audis are... good cars, as long as the electronics work, but expensive.

Forester... one of my front runners... but no H6, the Turbo H4 isn't as powerful as WRX or former Legacy/Outback turbos, no stick option with the turbo or hardly any options on a non-turbo, and only an archaic 4-speed auto, or a gelatinous CVT are offered. Again, not as many amenities as larger companies can offer on cars at the same price point.

Ford Edge is roughly the same size. The roof is slightly higher, but the interior is narrower. Externally about the same width. I like MKX's look and features better, but harder to find.

CRVs are even uglier than an Outback, and WAY worse looking than a Venza, IMHO. A boxy flat roof, and a continuous arch window graphic do not go well together, and the CRV's grille doesn't know what it is supposed to be looking like.

Almost everything that is boxier than Venza has 7 seats... I don't ever have 7 passengers, and mostly not more than 2 people in the car, but some occasional long cargo. I don't need 5+ feet of interior roof height, otherwise I would probably use a light/moderate-duty utility trailer. even higher roof and boxier shape costs gas every mile, including miles that are not cargo-laden.

If I could get a 2-door CUV, or an AWD shooting brake coupe with a bit of ride height, I would be interested... but those don't exist, and I *HATE* little blobs like the Juke that look ridiculous, and can't haul anything of any length despite the rear hatch body style.

Just out of curiosity, why do you think that an Edge, CX5 or 7, or a CRV would be any better than a similarly equipped Venza? Is it a Toyota brand thing? I can see where the Mazda would have the better handling reputation... but the CX5, like the new Ford Escape, are weirdly bulky, yet appealing-to-women designs that are taller and narrower than Outback/Venza/Allroad/S60, etc... taller (higher CG) and narrower is not a good handling combination, in general.

If Subaru would build the Cross Sport Concept 3-door coupe based on XV Crosstrek with WRX STI drivetrain, I would be SO enthused about that... but Subaru isn't big enough to compete on mainstream terms with big brands that have higher economies of scale.

Subarus don't quite keep up with Hondas, Toyotas, Fords, GMs, etc... on amenities and option lists anymore. Maybe in the 90's and early 2000s they did, but they barely add new amenities features anymore, for the $$$ being spent. I wish they did... but they did better as a niche player building things that the big brands don't focus on.

All Motor Is Best Motor > BoxerFanatic, troublesome iconoclast.
11/20/2013 at 18:14

I like those wheels.

BoxerFanatic, troublesome iconoclast. > All Motor Is Best Motor
11/20/2013 at 18:59

Five:AD S6:F, I believe... but unfortunately discontinued.