Destiny of the Dodge

"Slant6" (slant-6) 11/01/2013 at 15:02 • Filed to: Dodge Dart

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OK. I've posted about her before, but this is more than just the normal "look at my car and enjoy it".

Now that I have my Great Grandmother's 1965 Dodge Dart running I need to decide what to do with it. Background:

August 21st 1965: My Great Grandmother bought a brand new 1965 Dodge Dart 270. It came with the legendary 225 Slant Six putting something like 120 horsepower to the rear wheels through a three speed automatic.

Some time Early 80s: Car is given to great uncle

Early 90s: Great Uncle dies, car given to my dad who needs a shitty car to get to and from his job at a truck depot, where dust is constantly in the air and damaging the paint

1996 or 1997: Car is stored in my grandma's garage in New Jersey. Just parked. Door wasn't even closed all the way. My mom didn't want their young son to have to ride in a "death trap". (They got a 1995 Cherokee to replace it)

1997: I was born.

2010: My dad and I take the fourth of July weekend to drive from our home in Raleigh North Carolina to New Jersey with a U-haul trailer to retrieve the Dart.

we succeeded.

First thing we did to it once we got home was change the fuel tank. Then it sat for a year. Then in 2011 with the help of a friend we got her to run by changing the points, the spark plugs and some filters.

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=17…

It was the best day of my life.

After we got her running my dad had the brakes done at a shop (new master cylinder, drums all of it) and then registered and insured.

There was problems. At 55 the engine would stall. To adress this we changed the fuel pump, fuel filter, vacuum hoses, and a few other things. None seemed to work. Then two weeks ago I changed the fuel pick-up in the gas tank (by myself!) and now she runs like any slant six should.

So, Oppo... what next. I have an all original, unmolested, low millage (76,000, actual millage) Dodge Dart. My grandpa wants me to restore it. He restores cars and he has a collection (1965 Rambler, 1976 Diesel Mercedes, 1980 Rabbit Diesel (my favorite of them all), and some other large american things). He collects old "beige" cars, which the Dart kinda was. He also doesn't drive them. I want more from the Dart. I think I can make it fun to drive and I feel like it would be a fun resto-mod project.

Do you guys have any ideas? I like the current patina but I think paint would look good. Maybe getting the exhaust tuned. Perhaps an engine swap? I am a high school student so I don't really have money (I can talk my dad into paying for some things). I don't want to ruin her but at the same time I don't want her to be all restored and not driven. I want to drive her, like all cars should be. Be creative. It's a blank 1960s RWD canvas. Give me some ideas.

daender > Slant6 11/01/2013 at 15:06

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If you plan on keeping that sweet piece of metal around, then I'd suggest addressing important matters like the body. Stop all signs of rust, get any damage fixed, and respray it in the (my suggestion) original color and rust-proof whatever you can. From there, you can enjoy it as-is without worry of the metal cancer from its past life and can plan out future modifications from there.

Arch Duke Maxyenko, Shit Talk Extraordinaire > Slant6 11/01/2013 at 15:10

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383 and a 4 speed.

lone_liberal > Slant6 11/01/2013 at 15:22

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The best and worst thing about a project car is that you can do whatever you want. So many decisions! If you're trying to keep it on the cheap I would start with the purely practical, like rust repair, new carpets, etc., and keep modifications to a minimum. Then you can warm up the six with a few inexpensive parts if you like. At that point you might have a better idea with what you really want to do with it. Then you can get a plan together and try to stick to it. There is nothing as expensive as a constantly changing plan.

GhostZ > Arch Duke Maxyenko, Shit Talk Extraordinaire 11/01/2013 at 15:24

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Plenty of molested darts out there for that one.

I'd personally just jump straight to 440. No reason to get a 383 in today's economy.

webmonkees > Slant6 11/01/2013 at 15:25

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Yes, that. Take advantage of restoring-experienced grampa and have some weekends just going over that car. Then once you're confident it drives and stops right, start pursuing a motor of your choice but no need to set new quarter mile records, just Brisk. Be the sleeper.

Arch Duke Maxyenko, Shit Talk Extraordinaire > GhostZ 11/01/2013 at 15:27

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440 is just sooo big and heavy.

GhostZ > Slant6 11/01/2013 at 15:28

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Like daender said, get the body straight. #1 priority is making it rust-free and showroom clean.

While you can go for cheap speed, there are equally good options out there (Fox Body mustang, 240z or RX-7 with a 5.0 or LT1 swap, 80s Corvette, etc.) that don't come with the "ruining a classic" tradeoff.

You could go for some modified custom hot rod, but likewise there are tons of Darts out there with non-original motors, interiors, etc. to do that with.

That's why I agree with body work first. If you do that, it doesn't really matter how ratty the engine bay is or if the mechanical components are in good shape, it will always be ready to go in any direction the project goes.

The only thing I would say in addition to that, is that if you plan on making it fast , and you're willing to give up the value of restoring it and selling it (or the value of keeping it original) then when you tear the body down, go through some lightening and stiffening techniques. Maybe get it stitch welded, replace a few heavy components with aluminum, and add whatever cage you would need then. It's probably way easier to do that then to go back and do it after you've made the body straight and clean.

GhostZ > Arch Duke Maxyenko, Shit Talk Extraordinaire 11/01/2013 at 15:36

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Actually, it weighed almost the same as the 383. They used almost the same block. The deck height difference (which was the main difference between the blocks) is less than 1 inch. From my understanding, the weight difference wasn't a whole lot. The LA blocks , aka, the 318, 340, and 360, were significantly lighter though. There should be a bigger weight difference between Aluminum and Cast Iron heads on any engine, than between the 383 and the 440.

Now, having an extra carburetor (or two, in the case of the six pack), much heavier transmission to take the torque, more luxury peripherals, and a heavier exhaust means that a car with the 440 might have had components on it that made the car weigh quite a bit more, but that doesn't mean the engine itself was actually heavier, just the parts with it. You should, in all theory, be able to easily make a 440 within 50 lbs of a similarly equipped 383, from what I've read.

That's just a carefully read opinion though, and I haven't actually weighed the two engines. The 440 in some years did have significantly thicker and stronger load-bearing parts of its casting, so that might have added a few lbs of extra metal too.

Slave2anMG > Slant6 11/01/2013 at 15:37

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This car's a little jewel, a piece of Americana. Fix the rust - from NJ it WILL have rust - and paint and drive it. Leave the mighty slant six in place and enjoy the thing. I'd put a stereo in the glovebox or similar, hide speakers under the dash/seats/in the rear window shelf without cutting any holes. I love these kind of cars for the purity and simplicity of them. And are you still in Raleigh?

GhostZ > Slant6 11/01/2013 at 15:53

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Oh, and if you aren't concerned about appearance, value, or nostalgia, and you do want to do what I would do, that is, use it as a platform for cheap speed, here's what you need to do:

1. Get a late-70s 440 or 400 engine out of motorhome or some unloved utility vehicle. Use this as a guide for what to look for: http://www.440source.com/blockinfo.htm

2. Spend big on the internal parts. Get that motor comfortably revving, even if it means putting in a short crankshaft. Don't worry about losing displacement, a 3.375" crank in a 4.32" bore (440 with a 400 crank) still yields 396 Ci, but it will pull your redline higher.

3. Get a good pair of aluminum heads and have a professional port done on them, solid lifter cam, stiff springs, good rods, etc. You can get most of these parts new. Try to get heads that are fitted for a bored 426 Hemi if you can, to convert your engine into a 'hemi' spec engine. By now you're about $6000 into this motor.

4. Get a decent $2000 turbo kit. Run a blow-though setup.

Never need more power. Ever.

Ilike_cougars > Slant6 11/01/2013 at 15:56

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6.1 Hemi swap

Slant6 > Slave2anMG 11/01/2013 at 17:31

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Wake Forest, but I go to Enloe High School in Raleigh.

George McNally > Slant6 11/01/2013 at 17:54

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This sounds like a car you might keep forever....I'd get the bodywork taken care of and get a decent paint job on it.

For the rest of it?

Heck, I'd keep it stock until you had enough money to do whatever you have planned for it all at the same time.

If you are planning on putting a 440 in it and back-halving it-it would make sense to get it all done at once.

Slave2anMG > Slant6 11/01/2013 at 22:23

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Excellent....