It's harder and harder to say no to an Rx8.

"RotaryLover" (rotarylover) 10/09/2013 at 12:52 • Filed to: RotaryLove

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2004s are now under 5000$ and even though you know you won't do as much mileage and wont as reliable as another fun 4/6/8 cyl sports car, that you probably will change the engine in a couple of months, that you'll have to change the coilspacks that cost 150$ each, that you have to check the oil at each gas fill up and that it will probably have rust...how can you say no? When you have a unique piece of machinery, with sensual lines, an engine that goes to 9000 RPM and beyond without issue (except for the tranny that wont like it), comfortable ride on the highway, an interior that reminds you that you own a rotary powered car everywhere, space for 4 full adults, the ability to make fire once you remove the cat and that it's a complete hoonmobile from the start? I know I can't.

BugEyedBimmer - back in the Saddle Dakota Leather > RotaryLover 10/09/2013 at 12:56

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efme > RotaryLover 10/09/2013 at 13:03

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that one looks good. but only that one

RotaryLover > efme 10/09/2013 at 13:05

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I got good news for you! You can turn any 1st gen Rx8 like this for cheap! Now go buy one.

Casper > RotaryLover 10/09/2013 at 13:08

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A) Most 6 and 8 cylinder cars of the same era/price range won't get much better mileage if any.

B) Why would I want more than 2 people in my "hoonmobile"?

C) Rotaries are actually reasonably reliable, it's the owners that break them. It's no different than any specialty engine, be it a high comp NA v8 or high boost 4 cylinder. The engines tuned and maintained properly rarely just self destruct, it's usually the owner slacking on oil changes, putting cheap fuel in them, messing with the tune, or randomly "upgrading" parts for cheap Chinese parts off ebay.

RotaryLover > Casper 10/09/2013 at 13:24

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A) True, I agree with you with that.

B) Better weight distribution :P

C) I know that. But for most people it wont be because they can't get it out of their head that a Rotary engine is not a Piston engine and that there are things that you learn on forums that you don't learn on the owners manual and they don't do it + theses 2004 Rx8 at low prices might be compromised by the owner that didn't take care of it properly, that's why I said it might not be as reliable. And putting 0-5w20 oil in there from factory just for better mileage? What a mistake. Many owners that followed the manual got fucked because of that. The oil is just too thin, rotaries really need thicker oil.

BoxerFanatic, troublesome iconoclast. > RotaryLover 10/09/2013 at 13:26

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If I could get a car with RX8's modern features and construction tech...

But FC-3S looks. (a cheap used RX8 is more likely to be a sunny day car or a track toy... not a pseudo-family car... don't need the weight and complexity of the rear doors, or even the rear seats.)

If I want a sideline hobby car, I want it more gorgeous than an RX8, and practicality isn't really required. For a daily driver, or a backup winter slogger, I don't want to subject a RWD performance car, let alone a rotary powered one, to that.

The only thing better, would be to find a tube-framed mid-engined Manta Montage kit... (McLaren M6GT replica, mid-engined tube chassis better suited than the VW-pan rear-engined version, but that would be do-able) and put a rotary in THAT.

Casper > RotaryLover 10/09/2013 at 13:27

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That is true. It's very likely the last person was an idiot and did damage to the engine... although, if the apex seals are healthy when you get it, there isn't much else that would have taken damage usually. A compression test will help verify that right off the bat.

RotaryLover > Casper 10/09/2013 at 13:34

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And I wanna add that when you do a compression test on a rotary engine you need to know the RPM number. It could pass the compression test but if the RPM is too low, you know the engine is done for.

RotaryLover > BoxerFanatic, troublesome iconoclast. 10/09/2013 at 13:36

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You had to post a pic of a red RX7 that looks like the one dying in my garage :(

Casper > RotaryLover 10/09/2013 at 13:39

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The RPM? The RPM is variable due to a lot of other factors than engine health unless you are talking about something other than revolutions per minute...

PS9 > RotaryLover 10/09/2013 at 13:40

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Even at $5k, I still wouldn't take one over an FD. It's inferior by every metric.

PlayerWAN > RotaryLover 10/09/2013 at 13:44

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I'm holding my breath until R3s come down in price.

AbigGRNboot > RotaryLover 10/09/2013 at 13:45

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I had the same thought yesterday while browsing CL .

RotaryLover > Casper 10/09/2013 at 13:47

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Nope that's the right RPM I'm talking about. I know that 120psi is normal and 98.6psi is the minimum allowed and it must be all at 250rpm. If the RPM is under 250 when you crank it during the test, you have a problem. Probably the starter.

RotaryLover > PS9 10/09/2013 at 13:51

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True...but 9000$ for a beaten one, 15000-17000$ for a clean one when you can have a good experience with the Rx8 at 5000$. I would try the 8. + You better change all the vacuum lines and think of a way to remove as much heat as possible from the rotor housing.

RotaryLover > PlayerWAN 10/09/2013 at 13:51

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I'm with you there. It's slowly coming down now.

RotaryLover > AbigGRNboot 10/09/2013 at 13:53

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That's a beautiful example!

Milky > RotaryLover 10/09/2013 at 14:20

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Every time the RX-8 comes up I post and will continue to post this video.

feather-throttle-not-hair > RotaryLover 10/09/2013 at 14:26

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Just make sure you stay away from the automatic version.

I almost bought one, but ended up going with a 350Z instead.

CP2 > RotaryLover 10/09/2013 at 14:41

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I have one, and while earlier year cars do tend to be needy, after 2006 or so they're quite reliable. If you keep up with regular & preventative maintinence, it should be pretty trouble free. I'm not sure where you get that coilpacks are $150 each - they're about $20-30 each, and only the older model year cars really have issues with them. You can get away with checking oil every other fillup, and if you happen to forget, then the car has an idiot light to let you know when it's low.

Some people may lob around town in a SUV that gets 15-18mpg anyway, so keep the fuel economy in perspective. What really makes the RX-8 shine is the character. It can carry 4 regular (or even plus) sized people anywhere, but when you're going 1G+ through a turn with proper tires, every one of them will have the same grin on their face that you do as you come screaming out of it at 9K.

RotaryLover > Casper 10/09/2013 at 14:50

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I just took a shower and coffee. I can think more clearly now. Basically, if the RPM is not at 250 RPM you wont have the optimal PSI for the test. Most people that do the test do it because the car has trouble starting. Now if your RPM is too low, you neither have a tired starter, low voltage at the batteries or some other issue if that's not the case. When you fix that, then you do another compression test and see if it helps. A lot of 2004-05 Rx8 had issues with weak starters. That's why the 2nd gen Rx8 got a bigger better built starter.

RotaryLover > Milky 10/09/2013 at 14:52

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This is why I love rotaries :D

RotaryLover > feather-throttle-not-hair 10/09/2013 at 14:53

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Yeah, automatics gets the engine clogged with carbon + lower power.

Casper > RotaryLover 10/09/2013 at 14:55

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That's true. Generally if a starter is having issues you know it, but I guess it is possible for someone to mistake a starter failure for engine problems. I mean the first 3 items of the check list are always good/fully charged battery, good starter, proper temp engine. Without those things you can't really test a rotary... unless you bench test which would assume you probably have enough tools and knowledge to know what you are doing. The RPM doesn't actually change much about the compression measurements if you are doing a multiple compression passes... the real problem is most people try to use peak pressure measuring gauges.

http://www.racingbeat.com/mazda/performa…

RotaryLover > CP2 10/09/2013 at 14:56

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It has a idiot light?? I never knew! Nice to know. The coilpacks for 150$ are at the local stealership. You make me wanna get it even more....

feather-throttle-not-hair > RotaryLover 10/09/2013 at 15:12

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yeah, its a huge difference in power too, something like 30 hp. Every time i see an automatic RX-8 i get a little sad.

CP2 > RotaryLover 10/09/2013 at 16:04

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You can get coilpacks from just about any auto store for $20-35 each. I haven't needed to replace mine in 50k I've put on the car. If you are really considering picking one up, here's some more fun facts, courtesy of Mazda

!!! UNKNOWN CONTENT TYPE !!!

RX-8 Mazda Owner's Manual Product Update DVD from Kevin1024 on Vimeo .

magman007 > RotaryLover 10/09/2013 at 16:11

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As much as I love the rx8 (my father has one, the car got me into cars etc) 4 full size people aint fitting in it comfortably. You can make the rear passengers semi comfortable, at the expense of the front passengers. or you can remove your rear passengers legs, which will afford them the head room needed and leg room. its much "better" than a g35 coupe or a brz, but still, not ideal.

I do still want one, and I have heard the real key to longevity is to just premix a little oil in with every fill up, and keep an eye on the oil level and motor for a long long time.

roflcopter > Casper 10/09/2013 at 18:15

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People who don't know about rotaries need to stop spreading their 'knowledge'. I normally don't do this, but just about everyone in this little thread is wrong, cranking RPM plays a LOT into the compression numbers of a rotary, even more so in an rx8 with higher compression. And I've said it before, and I'll say it now, APEX SEALS ARE RARELY THE THING TO GO IN AN RX8!

I feel like every person who wants to talk about rotaries wants to feel smart by spouting off the two things they remember from that one article they read years ago: apex seals and oil weights.

/rant

Casper > roflcopter 10/09/2013 at 18:40

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You seem to be confused. We all already talked about having a proper minimum cranking RPMs from a healthy starter. The RPMs shouldn't vary from the normal starter cranking rate unless either the battery is getting low/bad, the starter is going out. There is no good reason that if you have the checklist met, you can't meet the 200 RPM minimum, and it's unlikely it will deviate by such a wide margin that you need to consult the chart. If your cranking RPM is varying widely then you probably have another issue.

The RPMs themselves matter as far as the number you get, maybe I should have been more clear about that. The point I was making is that the RPM number shouldn't be changing on a cranking engine. If I crank an engine get 8 pulses recorded, then come back and do it later with the starter and battery good, and engine at temp, it should be close enough I don't need to consult the chart.

If you did for some reason have a massive change (something about the rate at which the starter was working changed or something) then you would need to use this chart to figure out if your are still in the correct range.

roflcopter > Casper 10/09/2013 at 18:55

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I got kinja'd on that one. But while putting it that way makes more sense, I still HATE when people automatically say apex seals when rotaries are discussed.

Casper > roflcopter 10/09/2013 at 20:21

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It's certainly understandable why you would jump to the conclusion. Most people have no idea how to actually get the compression accurately on a rotary. They don't think about the fact there are 3 chambers in a rotation, they don't think about the fact that temperature matters, that you aren't measuring a single peak pressure, etc.

RotaryLover > magman007 10/10/2013 at 14:18

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I even heard that some people cut the auto oil injecting pump and premix the gas with some 2 stroke oil. This way they can use full synthetic.

RotaryLover > CP2 10/10/2013 at 14:30

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Ok. I want one!

Ceadda > RotaryLover 10/18/2013 at 06:33

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I own a 09 RX8 and the difference between the manual and automatic isn't too bad... The automatic was detuned with less HP, but nothing to worry about since i drive the manual transmission version