Why Aren't We Doing More To Stop People Like Jay Mieses?

"J. Walter Weatherman" (J-WalterWeatherman) 10/02/2013 at 18:58 • Filed to: None

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From the !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! article that Orlove linked to on the front page:

Though [Jay] Mieses [the douchecanoe that got his ass ran over by the Range Rover] is a Massachusetts resident, he has never had a valid Massachusetts driver’s license for a passenger vehicle and has never applied for a motorcycle license, the Registry of Motor Vehicles said.

Registry records show that applied for a learner’s permit in 1999 and 2000, but that he never obtained a full license because he failed to pay fines imposed after he was ticketed for speeding in Lawrence in 1999.

Since 1999, he has been ticketed by police 16 times.

So the guy has never in his life had a driver's license, yet that has apparently never let that stop him from driving. And on top of that, he drives poorly enough to get pulled over on at least 17 separate occasions, yet somehow nothing is being done to stop him from continuing to drive. How on earth do we let things get to this level? Surely there is something better that we can be doing to stop idiots like this from getting on the road.

The Boston Globe article indicates that the sum of the foregoing violations are at least enough for the wise state of Massachusetts to prohibit him from getting a driver's license until 2017, but what sort of punishment is that for someone that has proven that not having a driver's license is not something that will actually deter them from driving?

Honest question here: What sort of penalties should there be for habitual offenders like this guy?

People in the comments sections on the front page seem to be big fans of the death penalty without a trial, but let me throw out a couple more serious of ideas:

(1) People that don't have a license and also have multiple instances of driving without a license on their record should be prohibited from titling or registering a vehicle in their name, and if caught driving, should forfeit whatever vehicle they are driving.

(2) People that let unlicensed drivers borrow their car should face heavy fines, as well as be personally liable for any accidents caused by the driver. Repeat offenders should also face forfeiture of their car.

(3) Habitual offenders (lets say, people that have 5+ convictions for unlicensed driving in a 5 year period) go to jail.

What say you? Have any better ideas? As much as I like to solely blame the idiots like Mieses for the Range Rover incident, at some point, our failure to take serious action against people like him makes us part of the problem too.

Victorious Secret > J. Walter Weatherman 10/02/2013 at 19:00

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17 times and no one banned him from driving?

Well shit...crime really must pay the state well to allow that to happen.

Casper > J. Walter Weatherman 10/02/2013 at 19:00

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What do you really think it would do? This is a problem in most states and all they do is A) not pay the fines and B) ignore the threats. The jails are already over populated to the point they are releasing non-violent offenders early/without time. These people wouldn't even be processed, they judge would just wave them off with the fine that they would never pay.

It's the problem with a system based around the "because you have to" logic.

For Sweden > J. Walter Weatherman 10/02/2013 at 19:01

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None of these proposals would fly in California.

Nibby > J. Walter Weatherman 10/02/2013 at 19:03

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At first I thought "What did James May do wrong?"

J. Walter Weatherman > Victorious Secret 10/02/2013 at 19:04

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Well, it's actually the opposite of that. He has always been banned from driving, he just tends to ignore the fact that he is banned and continues to drive. And the state apparently does nothing more than say "No, I really mean it this tim e! Stop driving!" And then lets him hop back in his car a drive away...

J. Walter Weatherman > Casper 10/02/2013 at 19:04

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So you are saying there is nothing we can do?

vdub_nut: scooter snob > Victorious Secret 10/02/2013 at 19:04

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banning someone from driving doesn't much matter when that someone isn't licensed and keeps driving anyways. This whole situation is ridiculous.

Gamecat235 > J. Walter Weatherman 10/02/2013 at 19:05

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Idea number one seems the most feasible, with the exception of the seizure/forfiet of property, which leads to...

Idea two has some issues. Elderly relatives who don't realize that their children/grandchildren/relatives are not insured/licensed could be taken advantage of, and then lose their vehicle, potentially with no recourse (assuming Mieses-wannabe is an unlawful slacker that has no real assets).

Idea three sounds grand, but again, runs afoul of some hard luck situations that the rural down and out population encounter with some regularity. But fuck, something needs to be done, also, question for you: Will the fact that he was illegally riding work against him should any civil suit come up?

J. Walter Weatherman > Gamecat235 10/02/2013 at 19:09

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I agree with your point about not punishing people that didn't realize that they were lending their car to someone without a license - that's why there shouldn't be too serious of a penalty for people that unknowingly lend their vehicle to someone without a license. If you knowingly lend your car to someone without a license (e.g., you have previously been ticketed for lending that person your car) I don't see the problem with harsh penalties.

Casper > J. Walter Weatherman 10/02/2013 at 19:10

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This is the kind of problem that has been around forever. What do you take from a person with nothing to lose? It's not like he probably has much property to take, has a job worth harassing him at, etc. Even if you had prison space for him, you are basically saying "bad you, now we will feed you 3 times a day and pay for your benefits until you are rested and ready to leave".

Not likely to change his mind. This is why people have become extreme and violent in dealing with these problems in the past, because people will avoid pain/death even if they have nothing else... but that is one of those barbaric concepts that "works" but is generally unacceptable. Especially for a moving violation. Nature will run it's course and he will get shot/run over/killed in some way and Darwin will have his prize. Until then, not much to do about it.

J. Walter Weatherman > Casper 10/02/2013 at 19:15

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So basically poor people can do whatever the fuck they want and put us all in danger because there is nothing worth taking from them? I'm all for creative solutions/penalties and reducing prison populations, but just saying "ah, fuck it, do whatever you want" just doesn't sound like a very good solution to me.

Casper > J. Walter Weatherman 10/02/2013 at 19:17

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Welcome to the real world. Now you know why everyone is so pessimistic and angry all the time.

jimaha6 > J. Walter Weatherman 10/02/2013 at 19:24

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In the U.K. the police either take your motorbike and sell it, or crush it.

J. Walter Weatherman > jimaha6 10/02/2013 at 19:28

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I'm not really a big fan of the whole crushing thing, because that is just a waste.

I also understand there can be a concern about forfeiture laws being overly punitive, but in the case where someone is a habitual offender, is legally prohibited from owning a vehicle, yet has intentionally found a way around that and continues to drive, I think that it can be justified.

jimaha6 > J. Walter Weatherman 10/02/2013 at 19:48

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Yeah I agree,

the law is mainly enforced against motorbikes that are not road worthy, for example pit bikes and trail bikes, that have been spotted being ridden on the road. Usually the people who own the bikes are under age kids who got one for Christmas and have nowhere to ride it. Sucks for them I guess.

It also can happen to your car or motorbike for not having a license, insurance and road tax etc. The DVLA basically say it is our roads and if you don't abide by the rules we'll take the vehicle to stop you infringing our rules.

I should also say it's not the first course of action, you have to be a repeat offender and ignore the fines for this sort of thing to happen.

rabbitman > J. Walter Weatherman 10/02/2013 at 20:13

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Sounds like my step brother, bothers the shit out of me when I see him driving, his is even worse reason he is a epileptic... One seizure and he could kill some one or his family.

Squid > J. Walter Weatherman 10/02/2013 at 20:59

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Heavy fines and wage garnishment for not paying. If the person doesn't have a job mandatory audits every year. Habitual offenders should relinquish thier vehicle on the spot and should have to walk or spend time working 18 hours a day in the jail to pay off their debt. The real matter of fact is that there really is nothing that can be done short of seizing the vehicles and selling them at auction. I dunno, it may seem callous but these people get what is coming to them, just look at the poor SOB in the hospital. . .

I am actually curious if this guy's family is going to try suing the RR guy. I for one say there is no basis for a case, apply the DUI standard to an unlicensed driver. He doesn't have a license and therefor should not have been where he was. . .

gmporschenut also a fan of hondas > J. Walter Weatherman 10/03/2013 at 00:02

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It's really a bullshit situation. i would say put a lien on any assets but most unlicensed drivers have nothing to loose. My friend's car got hit by a 15 year old that had taken his grandmothers car. It became a giant mess with insurance. The only thing i can think of is some sort of public shaming. Since you like moving without restriction you will now be stuck in the stockades.

You can tell a Finn but you can't tell him much > J. Walter Weatherman 10/03/2013 at 11:53

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Specifically regarding people like Mr. Meises; at this point vehicles need to be seized and crushed. He's proven that he won't pay fines, he's proven that he will keep driving and/or riding and he's proven that he is a danger to society when on the road. After 17 tickets for driving without a license and the state banning him from driving until at least 2017 because of unpaid tickets anybody who knows him well enough to loan him a car knows that he shouldn't be driving. So I don't have any sympathy for an "innocent" person getting their car crushed by loaning it to a dirtbag like this.

More generally to reduce the likelihood of incidents like this happening in the future stricter penalties need to be enacted against offenders who are actually caught on these rides. I think the best deterrent would be to start seizing and crushing vehicles that are used in this type of ride. By choosing to associate with these kind of [redacted] you are a major part of the problem. The police impounded a number of bikes from this gathering. Every single impounded bike needs to be crushed for it to act as a deterrent. Simply letting the offenders get their bike out of impound in a month or two after paying a fine obviously isn't enough of a deterrent to stop disorganized and unlawful behavior. By crushing the bikes that are impounded for participating in a ride like this the police do not have to try to find out everyone in the ride which they don't do anyway. If a few guys get their bikes crushed every ride then it significantly disincentivizes participating in these types of events.