by "AestheticsInMotion" (aestheticsinmotion)
Published 12/21/2017 at 22:56
by "AestheticsInMotion" (aestheticsinmotion)
Published 12/21/2017 at 22:56
Tags: 404 error - Tl:Dr not found
STARS: 6
The best performing tire out there... that won’t win you any races. A completely biased Oppo-review.
Full disclosure: As a long time advocate of these heavenly rubber circles of happiness and joy, I’ve wanted to write up my thoughts for quite a while. I’ve put these tires through more than any sane individual would ever choose to, and as such I’ve got a unique perspective to offer you. For what it’s worth, I had Bridgestone RE71R’s prior to these, and shitty offbrand all-seasons prior to both of those. I drive a modified Miata with stock power levels, weighing in at roughly 2100 pounds, and have been using 205/50 tires on 15x8 wheels.
What are they?
The ZII star specs are Dunlop’s signature extreme performance summer tire, introduced to compete with the likes of Bridgestone, Toyo, BFGoodrich and a handful of others in the ultra competitive “200tw” category. In terms of pure speed, these have turned out to be pretty middle-of-the-pack. While the new ZIII Star Specs (only available in Japan currently) have been redesigned with the hopes of dethroning Bridgestone’s Re71r as the fastest tire, the slower ZII’s have a number of traits that make them a fantastic choice for a wide variety of enthusiasts.
Lasting Power
Rating tires of this performance level on longevity is akin to judging hypercars by their mpg’s, but it still needs to be mentioned. These are no R1R’s that you’d be lucky to get 10,000 miles out of. They’re leagues above the Re71r, which wear quicker than most 100tw tires and even some 40tw tires. The miles you can get out of these is head and shoulders above the rest of the group. I’m currently just over two years running these—all four seasons—with between 70-80k miles racked up since the first day they touched the pavement. The elephant in the room—yes—they’re abso-fucking-lutly beat to shit. That’s clear from the header image, and will be made even more clear with some closeups. BUT. They’ve never been rotated. They’ve been driven in anger for thousands of miles on gravel, at full 10/10, not holding back even a hair. They’ve seen track time, been autox’d, amateur drifting.... Oh, and every morning Monday through Friday for the last two years, the rears MIGHT have possibly been converted into smoke on one particular on-ramp near my work. This is something that I’ve been unable to verify, but I’m told it could be true. Anyways, what I’m trying to get across is that these tires have been beat to death, zapped back to life, only to get brutally manhandled once more time and time agaim.... And yet they’ve never missed a beat.
It’s not just a matter of longevity either. Dunlop made a 200tw tire that keeps 90% of it’s grip right to the moment you start seeing cords. That’s incredible! The re71-r? As soon as you get through the first layer of rubber, you’ll notice a huge drop off in dry grip, and “rain” will be your new four letter word for terror. It’s even worse for cold weather. The re71r and most of its competition will be comparatively ruined after a month of driving in sub-freezing temperatures. Even after the temps climb back up, even if the treads are still full, the tires will be so far off in terms of grip due to the rubber compound breaking down that you’ll be better off saving them for drift spares. Dunlop’s magic little pavement eaters, are different.
Grip: Dry, Wet, Winter Conditions
Dry grip is great. If you’ve always driven on all-seasons, these will blow your mind. Even thehigher 300tw summer rubber is so far off as to make upgrading to Star Specs seem like a holy experience. I’ve never driven another tire that so quickly translates steering wheel input to changing direction. The breakaway zone—where you meet the absolute limits of grip—is incredibly forgiving, coming on slowly in such a way that even novices can feel comfortable approaching (and passing) the limit. If tires do break loose, they’re quick to hook back to the tarmac, without being too abrupt or jarring. That said.... There are definitely faster options on dry pavement if you’re serious about competition. Rival S, RE71R, RS3 v2.... These and a few others are classed in the same (semi-meaningless) 200tw category, and they will all post faster lap times in dry conditions.
Wet grip review brought to you by a life-long seattle resident. The rumors are true, the PNW is more-or-less constant rain (so, uh. Don’t move here). In Washington, a year-round tire absolutely has to be able to handle water. Lots of it. The ZII star spec can handle more water than it has any right to, for a tire with such minimal siping it’s somewhat curious HOW it manages to grip so hard, and stay so well-controlled in wet conditions. Seriously, It’s not “good for a summer tire”. It’s good period. I’d place the wet grip of this rubber above at least half of the all-seasons I’ve driven, and there’s no question in my mind that the Dunlop is significantly better than every other 200tw summer tire in this catagory. Kicking the back out is easy, but it won’t happen by chance. 80% throttle and below and the driving dynamics are similar to dry, go beyond that (or kick the clutch) and you can get a wonderfully smooth slide that is a breeze to recover from. I Haven’t tried any of the race rubber specifically made for wet conditions so I can’t offer any sort of comparison there, and I’ll also add that while Washington State gets a lot of rain, we very rarely experience super heavy downfall with high water buildup on the roads.
In even just a single inch of snow, these are garbage and you’ll crash, destroy your car, and probably die horribly, even if there’s only half an inch of snow, and even if you’re sticking to 5mph. Drop an ice cube on an ice skating rink. That’s how much grip you have. Changing steering angle will do nothing, it’s actually quite comical. A perfectly modulated throttle MIGHT propel you in whatever direction you happen to be sliding at the moment, but 95% of the time your tires will just be spinning uselessly. I’m not trying to paint these as miracle tires. They’re phenomenal in how versatile they are for their performance level, but they’re not magic. If you expect snow where you live, either swap tires or don’t drive. It’s that simple. If it starts snowing, you’re probably okay to immediately drive home, but as soon as there is the slightest layer sticking to the ground your fate is in the hands of God.
I know all of that because I happened to be at the gym when my city got its once-yearly snow and decided to dump three inches between 9-11pm. After spending thirty minutes doing donuts in the parking lot (denting a wheel in the process) I drove the quarter mile back to my house at midnight. For one flat section I got out and pushed because my 200 pounds self in Converse all-stars could accelerate and bring to a stop my Miata quicker and safer than the tires. After that harrowing night... My baby spent three days under a tarp, unable to even make it out of the parking spot I’d miraculously managed to slide into unscathed.
As for ice, it’s not ideal but it’s definitely doable. If you pay attention you’ll be fine. The same easy-as-can-be breakaway when your tires break loose as on dry pavement, only now it happens a hair quicker and can sneak up on you. Driving these tires on cold pavement with ice is like driving a Stock Evo 9 under normal conditions. It requires your full attention, understand that and there won’t be issues. I’d say the Star Specs are comparable to cheap Chinese all-seasons in terms of ice grip, but the Dunlop’s have a bit of an edge simply because they transmit so much more feel. I’ve had zero problems driving through ice the last thirty days on my way to work, and this is what my tires currently look like...
Odds & Ends
Three flat tires with my old all-seasons, two with the RE71R’s and zero with the Dunlop’s that had more miles than the other two sets combined. Probably just luck of the draw, but who knows. Make of that what you will.
On dry level ground, from a standing start there was no way I could spin the rear tires. With the all-seasons I had to launch under 4000rpm for optimal grip. With these... I did one test at redline and hooked effortlessly, but didn’t test further because while I do plan on upgrading everything, I’m not quite ready for major driveline failure.
Not as wide-ly available as some of the competition, at least for a 15 inch wheel. 205's are as wide as it gets. :(
Easy to control in mild offroad conditions, but in no way competitive. Lots of fun, if only because you’ll be spinning your driven wheels like crazy when you give it the gas, while still retaining the ability to climb and descend steep gravely grades with low gears and careful throttle application.
Negatives
Noise. Summer tires will be noisier than all-seasons all other things being equal. These are pretty average compared to the rest of the 200tw catalog, but as they wear they get much louder, at a quicker rate than all but the Kumhos and Falkens, based off of my experience, and the consensus of the greater Miata hive mind. The last 10,000 miles the noise has gotten very loud, to the point where tire noise is possibly louder than the exhaust from the drivers seat. If you want a fast tire that’s fairly quiet and will stay that way, these aren’t for you. Best suited for cars that already make various racecar sounds.
That’s.... Really all I’ve got for negatives. Obviously there are things that apply to the entire summer tire category but as for this specific tire.... Just noise really. That’s the only thing I’d care to see improved. Sure, faster is better, but I don’t want that at the expense of any other characteristic here. Tire Rack put these on clearance a few months ago, but in my size at least, they raised the prices right before the “clearance sale” thus making each clearance tire two dollars more than the “normal priced” tire. That’s pretty underhanded, but I’d imagine that’s on tire rack and has nothing to do with Dunlop.
Overall, fantastic tires that I wholeheartedly recommend for anyone looking to DD a fun car, or a somewhat novice racer who wants a good sticky tire that’s easy to read.
"Sweet Trav" (thespunbearing)
12/21/2017 at 23:10, STARS: 0
I have a set of RE71's that just wont die. 3500 road miles and 8 or so autox events, not even to the first set of wear bars. AND race weight with me in it is about 3800lbs...
as with most things. YMMV
"AestheticsInMotion" (aestheticsinmotion)
12/21/2017 at 23:15, STARS: 0
Stock, or more aggressive alignment? Strange either way based off of what I’ve seen and experienced, but hey! If you’ve got the fastest tires and they’re holding up that well more power to you!
"CodyVella" (codyvella)
12/21/2017 at 23:22, STARS: 1
I remember wanting a set of these but couldn’t find them in my size. In fact, the only tires that come in the factory size for my 944 are Firestone Firehawk SZ50s and BfGoodrich Radial T/As. At least the Radial T/As have raised white lettering which suits the car.
"Scary__goongala!" (corymagee)
12/21/2017 at 23:24, STARS: 1
I really wanted to buy these last summer to put on my RPF1s. But I decided I shouldn’t spend that much per corner yet. I’m very happy with the BFG Sport Comp 2s I got, but Star Specs will most likely be the next set to go on.
"Sweet Trav" (thespunbearing)
12/21/2017 at 23:25, STARS: 0
-2 degrees camber, 7-8 degrees caster. .125 toe in.
"Wagon Guy drives a Boostang" (gimmeboost)
12/21/2017 at 23:38, STARS: 1
I might have looked at these for Autocross tires, which are in my budget for March, but they’re more expensive than the RE71r’s in the size I need (275/35/19)
"AestheticsInMotion" (aestheticsinmotion)
12/21/2017 at 23:43, STARS: 0
I would happily accept that problem if it meant having a 944. Someday....
What size tire do you need to run? Is there no wiggle room?
"WRXforScience" (WRXforScience)
12/21/2017 at 23:55, STARS: 0
When I started autox nearly a decade ago, the ZI* was the go to performance tire and it was king of the hill for about 5 years. Then, the manufacturers started getting serious about grip levels and came out with a new generation. I liked my ZII* but they weren’t competitive. They are about as good as RS3's but both will heat cycle out well before they wear out. The current generation of fast “200 tw” tires are on a whole different level (I get an extra 0.2g on the RE71's over what I could get with RS3v2 and about the same over the ZII*).
Those older “longer lasting” tires were good for 100-150 competitive runs and another 50-100 off pace runs followed by however long you wanted to be slow until you corded them or gave up. RE71's stay sticky all the way down to the cords (it is possible to heat cycle them, but they are soft enough that if you’re keeping the road miles down you won’t). I get about 150 runs out of a set of RE71r’s and they are all competitive.
You need more than one set of tires and you have to rotate your tires Rotating your tires is a maintenance issue (your goal should be even wear on all 4, uneven wear can cause mechanical issues like excessive wear on diffs (if you’ve got an lsd) brakes, and suspension components. I limit myself to 3 sets of wheels and tires, but I live in Texas and there is no real winter(I’d allow myself a 4th set for winter if I lived somewhere with real seasons).
In my STX BRZ, I run about 30 autocrosses and another 10-15 trackdays every year (I have co-drivers at about a dozen autox events too), so the last couple of years I’ve been going through 3+ sets of tires. The last 2 seasons I’ve gone exclusively to RE71's and I’ll probably do the same for 2018.
My autox class is super competitive, with 5-6 different drivers who could take first at any of the events and are usually all within 0.5s of the lead. There are another 3-4 drivers who are within a second of the leader and another 5 or so stragglers bringing up the rear. We all run RE71's exclusively because anytime anyone has tried a cheaper/slower wearing tire they fall out of contention.
I don’t recommend RE71's for non-competitive use. I’ll leave mine on for a week at a time, but that usually represents under 100 miles of driving.
"WRXforScience" (WRXforScience)
12/21/2017 at 23:55, STARS: 2
When I started autox nearly a decade ago, the ZI* was the go to performance tire and it was king of the hill for about 5 years. Then, the manufacturers started getting serious about grip levels and came out with a new generation. I liked my ZII* but they weren’t competitive. They are about as good as RS3's but both will heat cycle out well before they wear out. The current generation of fast “200 tw” tires are on a whole different level (I get an extra 0.2g on the RE71's over what I could get with RS3v2 and about the same over the ZII*).
Those older “longer lasting” tires were good for 100-150 competitive runs and another 50-100 off pace runs followed by however long you wanted to be slow until you corded them or gave up. RE71's stay sticky all the way down to the cords (it is possible to heat cycle them, but they are soft enough that if you’re keeping the road miles down you won’t). I get about 150 runs out of a set of RE71r’s and they are all competitive.
You need more than one set of tires and you have to rotate your tires Rotating your tires is a maintenance issue (your goal should be even wear on all 4, uneven wear can cause mechanical issues like excessive wear on diffs (if you’ve got an lsd) brakes, and suspension components. I limit myself to 3 sets of wheels and tires, but I live in Texas and there is no real winter(I’d allow myself a 4th set for winter if I lived somewhere with real seasons).
In my STX BRZ, I run about 30 autocrosses and another 10-15 trackdays every year (I have co-drivers at about a dozen autox events too), so the last couple of years I’ve been going through 3+ sets of tires. The last 2 seasons I’ve gone exclusively to RE71's and I’ll probably do the same for 2018.
My autox class is super competitive, with 5-6 different drivers who could take first at any of the events and are usually all within 0.5s of the lead. There are another 3-4 drivers who are within a second of the leader and another 5 or so stragglers bringing up the rear. We all run RE71's exclusively because anytime anyone has tried a cheaper/slower wearing tire they fall out of contention.
I don’t recommend RE71's for non-competitive use. I’ll leave mine on for a week at a time, but that usually represents under 100 miles of driving.
"CodyVella" (codyvella)
12/21/2017 at 23:57, STARS: 1
I run 225/60R15s because I have an early car with Turbo wheels, so 225s are the narrowest I can go, going wider isn’t much of an issue. I could go smaller than a 60 aspect ratio, but it looks weird when on a 15" rim. My next step is to move up to a 16" rim which opens up a world of options. I just haven’t decided if I’m going to look towards 16" phone dials or a set of Aero Race Wheels.
"AestheticsInMotion" (aestheticsinmotion)
12/22/2017 at 00:11, STARS: 0
225's are the narrowest... 9 inch wide wheels than? 225/45/15 is well loved by the Miata crowd, but obviously very different proportions.
Phone dials are so wonderful. If only they were 15" and 4x100
"CodyVella" (codyvella)
12/22/2017 at 00:37, STARS: 0
Precise, late 944 Turbo S phone dials were 9" wide, and for some reason one of my older 944s came with a set so I’ve hung on to them (because they fit on ‘83-’85.5 N/As).
I know a lot of guys that have bought adapters to fit phone dials on their Jettas & Golfs (apparently that’s a thing that’s popular). So I guess it’s an option for Miata owners, if you trust adapters.
"AM3R, lost another burner" (am3r17)
12/22/2017 at 03:33, STARS: 1
You’ve done a good job convincing me to buy these for my 335i... I was thinking about new wheels.
"Arrivederci" (arrividerci)
12/22/2017 at 08:03, STARS: 1
Star Specs are my favorite DD and tracking 200tw tire. RE71R is the best for autocross, but wears stupid fast if you try and DD it and gets greasy on the track after just a handful of laps. I’d love a set of Star Specs on my summer wheels, but pricing them at Tire Rack, that’d be over $1k in rubber and in a size that’s not super ideal :(.
"ateamfan42" (ateamfan42)
12/22/2017 at 09:20, STARS: 1
When the Star Specs were first released, and everyone raved about what an amazing tire they were, I looked up price for the 18" fitment for the MS6 I had at the time. The numbers made my eyes water.
When I got the Miata a couple years ago, I revisited the pricing in 15" fitment, and was pleasantly surprised. I ran one set for a summer (with autocross), and part of the next season. I wanted to try RE-71s next but they couldn’t be had anywhere, so I got another set of Star Specs. The better life and nearly as good grip means I’m still happy how it worked out.
For the cold mornings in the fall before I’ve switched to winter tires, or spring right after I’ve made the switch back to the summers, the Star Specs do quite well in the cool temps compared to some other extreme performance options. There are some out there that warn you not to even roll the car below 30 degF for risk of cracking the tires. Here in unpredictable New England, that really isn’t an acceptable option on a daily driver. It’s not unusual to wake up one June or September morning to near-freezing (or even sub-freezing) temps.
"AestheticsInMotion" (aestheticsinmotion)
12/22/2017 at 15:32, STARS: 0
I’m really hoping to see price cuts when they clear inventory for the next gen. Fingers crossed
"AestheticsInMotion" (aestheticsinmotion)
12/22/2017 at 15:33, STARS: 1
RPF1s? Sew fawncy! Did you manage to find a set in a 15"?
"Scary__goongala!" (corymagee)
12/22/2017 at 18:56, STARS: 1
Yeah, they are 15x7s with the stock offset.