by "Textured Soy Protein" (texturedsoyprotein)
Published 11/21/2017 at 15:49
by "Textured Soy Protein" (texturedsoyprotein)
Published 11/21/2017 at 15:49
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STARS: 1
As many of you know, I’m a hippy (with a fancy corporate job) and also a fitness
addict
nerd. I was already a sorta-hippy carnivore but my wife and I have become increasingly drawn to ditching meat. Now I’m going to do it.
What do I mean by sorta-hippy carnivore? Generally when grocery shopping I would try to only buy meat, eggs and dairy where the animals were treated nicely. But that didn’t stop me from eating meat, eggs and dairy of unknown provenance in restaurants, the pre-made entrees from grocery stores, etc. So only sorta hippy.
I didn’t feel entirely ok with this status quo, but also hadn’t made an effort to change it. My wife and I are total suckers for animals, especially our pets, and it became increasingly difficult for us to reconcile how we spoil the crap out of our cats and yet also eat the products of industrial animal farming.
My wife has been getting into farm sanctuaries, and found this documentary about them, Called To Rescue . We watched it this past weekend and while I didn’t have the same emotional reaction as she did, it definitely got me thinking real hard about my food choices.
The reality is, “humanely raised” meat is still the flesh of a dead animal. And unless you get eggs or dairy from farms that you know treats their animals nicely, the animals are often treated like crap.
There’s a scene in that documentary where one of the farm sanctuaries does a mass rescue of like 1500 hens from a factory egg farm, and the birds get driven in crates to the sanctuary, then they unload the crates and open the tops and the birds all pop up out of the crates and flap around and they’re all like, “I can be a chicken now!”
The image that stuck with me from this scene was that the birds have their beaks trimmed and many of them look just unhealthy, with patches of missing feathers or otherwise seeming worse for the wear. The folks from the farm sanctuary say that factory egg farmers consider their hens “spent” after only about 18 months to 2 years of age, and kill them off and dispose of them in mass quantities because they’re not appealing as meat.
I didn’t like this idea at all, and the information about factory dairy farming was similarly bleak. So I’ve kicked around ideas for the past few days and I’ve come up with a simple plan that I’m going to follow:
No meat
Eggs & dairy only from farms that treat animals nicely
I already buy hippy-friendly eggs , but I’ll have to give up eating eggs in restaurants, because they usually don’t buy hippy-friendly eggs.
!!! UNKNOWN CONTENT TYPE !!!
I don’t eat much in the way of dairy, but what I do eat usually comes in two forms: whey protein in protein bars, and cheese. There are some potentially hippy-friendly whey protein based bars, in that they specify they use whey from grass-fed cows. That’s at least something, but not super specific. I might consider these, but there are also vegan protein bars which cause no concerns.
Cheese is a little trickier because the hippy-friendliness of its milk isn’t often disclosed on its labeling, but I’m in Wisconsin. It’s still pretty easy to find hippy-friendly cheese here. I’m going through the scorecards from The Cornucopia Institute so I’ll know which brands of dairy at the supermarket will be ok.
(We might make an exception for the occasional pizza with cheese of unknown provenance.)
Otherwise, a lot of my diet is already plant-based food I make from scratch. Basically every week I make some kind of big pot of beans, lentils, etc. I know all kinds of tricks with veggies, and I get new and different kinds of produce from places like the Asian market across the street from my gym. I’ve even perfected recipes like crispy glazed tofu, and vegan chili using textured soy protein.
Anyway, I know the joke about vegans...
How do you know if someone’s a vegan?
Don’t worry, they’ll tell you.
...definitely applies here even though I’m not quite going vegan.
My last carnivore hurrah is going to be some turkey this thanksgiving, and if I have the opportunity at some point in the future to host thanksgiving at my house, I might go so far as to get a turkey from my local hippy butcher .
I promise I’m not going to become some PETA crazy person , or to preach that what you do with your food choices is evil. But I wanted to share.
"EL_ULY" (uly)
11/21/2017 at 15:55, STARS: 0
Nobel views, go for it.
I wish going vegetarian was cheaper lol.
"E90M3" (e90m3)
11/21/2017 at 15:55, STARS: 0
I have a tougher conundrum, if you meet someone who is a vegan who does crossfit, what do they tell you fit? Because as we know, how do you know someone does crossfit? They tell you.
"Wacko" (wacko--)
11/21/2017 at 15:56, STARS: 3
just don’t eat all of my food’s food.
"TorqueToYield" (torquetoyield)
11/21/2017 at 15:57, STARS: 0
How do you know when a vegan does cross-fit? Because they never mention they’re vegan.
"jimz" (jimz)
11/21/2017 at 15:58, STARS: 0
IMO the best way to go about it is to focus on dishes from areas where a lot of the people don’t eat meat (South Asian, Mediterranean, etc.) I could subsist on falafel for a long time* if I so chose. Fake meat/meat replacements are almost universally awful. Except for the Morningstar spicy chipotle black bean veggie burgers, them things are tasty.
That said, I take a different view in that (like my “butcher” post a few days ago) if I’m going to eat meat then I should be willing and able to do the dirty work myself (after a clean, er, dispatch.)
* seriously, I could grab a falafel wrap from New Yasmeen Bakery for 3 meals a day until I got tired of it
"PanchoVilleneuve ST" (PanchoVilleneuve)
11/21/2017 at 15:58, STARS: 0
It’s a lot easier than you’d think. Source: a pescetarian that is effectively vegetarian since fish is expensive.
"Textured Soy Protein" (texturedsoyprotein)
11/21/2017 at 15:59, STARS: 0
It’s really not expensive though, unless you rely on pre-made vegetarian meat substitutes. There’s all kinds of cheap sources of plant protein if you’re willing to do the cooking. I already do a bunch of scratch cooking, and actually a lot of it is already plant protein like beans, or bean-derived things like tofu and textured soy protein.
"diplodicus" (diplodicus)
11/21/2017 at 16:00, STARS: 0
I’d be interested in a macro break down once your in your groove. I’ve considered going vegetarian, but I’m just not sure how realistic it is for me right now. I technically don’t get enough calories and could use more fat and protein and lower my carbs but I have zero idea how I’d accomplish that cutting out meat. I don’t eat a ton of meat, so I could live without it. I don’t think I could live without dairy though. That’s where I get most of my calories/protein.
"TorqueToYield" (torquetoyield)
11/21/2017 at 16:01, STARS: 1
I really like Mark Bittman - it’s not vegan so YMMV
https://www.amazon.com/How-Cook-Everything-Vegetarian-Meatless/dp/0764524836
Also, any cookbook by Madhur Jaffry
"Textured Soy Protein" (texturedsoyprotein)
11/21/2017 at 16:03, STARS: 0
A lot of my cooking is already plant-based. I added a paragraph about that.
"Textured Soy Protein" (texturedsoyprotein)
11/21/2017 at 16:04, STARS: 0
I stole Mark Bittman’s orange peel black beans recipe a few years ago.
"Textured Soy Protein" (texturedsoyprotein)
11/21/2017 at 16:09, STARS: 0
This isn’t a macro breakdown exactly, because I don’t fuss over macros, but my typical daily eating looks roughly like:
Breakfast: protein bar + piece of fruit
Lunch: turkey & cheddar on whole wheat sandwich, carrots & hummus, maybe some chips
Snack: protein bar, maybe a piece of fruit
Dinner: A nice heaping dinner plate of something like 1/3 grain+beans, 1/3 plate veggies, 1/3 protein
And I’ll have coffee, and maybe snack on some nuts or sunflower seeds.
All I really need to do differently is switch up my lunches to something more like my dinners, and sub out the animal proteins for plant (or hippy egg/dairy) sources.
"RPM esq." (rpm3)
11/21/2017 at 16:12, STARS: 1
If this is an AMA, my question is: which cut of steak should I eat for dinner tonight?
Don’t worry, it will be humanely-raised relatively locally and grass-fed, and I will purchase it at a hippie co-op grocery store.*
* Primarily because it is the closest grocery store to my house.
"415s30 W123TSXWaggoIIIIIIo ( •_•))°)" (415s30)
11/21/2017 at 16:13, STARS: 0
Yeah I am an animal lover, I don’t eat red meat because it makes me feel like crap, I don’t agree with it environmentally either. But my wife is Japanese so seafood is kind of a must. Meat wise I mostly eat turkey and fish, I do get bison bars for work when I’m stuck and can’t get to food, but I also eat probars that are vegetarian. I’m 39, I’ve been thinking about going all in at 40.
"Shoop" (shoopdawoop993)
11/21/2017 at 16:13, STARS: 4
“reconcile how we spoil the crap out of our cats and yet also eat the products of industrial animal farming.”
Easy enough. Eat the cats.
"beardsbynelly - Rikerbeard" (beardsbynelly-Rikerbeard)
11/21/2017 at 16:14, STARS: 0
That’s pretty close to how I am, I get my eggs from a friends local hobby farm, straight from the chicken butt and my milk is from a dairy just outside of the city.
I’ll eat animal products if either it’s going to go to waste of if it’s a banquet type deal with no veg options.
"Textured Soy Protein" (texturedsoyprotein)
11/21/2017 at 16:23, STARS: 0
Flank steak if you have time to marinate it (add a teaspoon of baking soda to your marinade to speed up tenderization) or otherwise a bone-in ribeye.
"Future next gen S2000 owner" (future-next-gen-s2000-owner)
11/21/2017 at 16:39, STARS: 0
Since you are in Wisconsin, what about wild game? They live the freest life possible and if you hunt yourself, you know exactly how humanely they were put down.
For example, wild turkey on Thanksgiving. Fish form Lake Michigan that you catch. Vension from whitetail.
Not trying to change your mind but it seems to me if the treatment is the reason to go full veggie, where does wild game fall?
"SPAMBot - Horse Doctor" (spambot2002)
11/21/2017 at 16:52, STARS: 0
ONE OF US, ONE OF US!
Contrary to my screen name and avatar, I do not eat spam. Much like you are contemplating, I stopped eating meat the day after thanksgiving in 2004. I still eat eggs and dairy, although I normally buy semi hippie eggs. I didn’t do it for any particular reason back then but sustainability is growing more important to me. It seems like you have thought this through so I’d say go for. Really, you have nothing to lose by trying.
I will say that it is hard being a vegetarian crossfit-er. When I meet new people, I never know which to talk about first ;)
"Pickup_man" (zekeh)
11/21/2017 at 16:55, STARS: 0
Although I may not agree %100, I have zero issues with your views or decisions, however, I do take issue with this statement.
And unless you get eggs or dairy from farms that you know treats their animals nicely, the animals are often treated like crap.
The vast majority of my friends are deeply involved in the Ag industry, from plant sciences, to animal sciences, to simple farmers and from personal experience I find this statement inherently untrue. These animals are the livelihood of everyone who raises them and they are generally treated with the highest quality care and respect. I fully believe that you will find this to be true on nearly any farm across the country. Clearly some unethical environments exist and that is %100 not acceptable and measures need to be taken to stop and prevent that kind of treatment. Those examples however are generally cherry picked and exaggerated for the purposes of, and I hate using this phrase, pushing an agenda. These types of farms are few and far between, and I feel that assuming or insinuating otherwise is an insult to all of those people who work tirelessly to give their animals the best care possible.
"Rico" (ricorich)
11/21/2017 at 16:55, STARS: 0
For the milk you can try Silk Nut Protein Milk it’s got a decent amount of protein in it unlike the normal Almond milks.
Also I’ve not even red meat in 9 months, pork and chicken are probably next. I only want to eat red meat for my birthday, at a proper steakhouse.
"SPAMBot - Horse Doctor" (spambot2002)
11/21/2017 at 16:56, STARS: 0
I spend $25-45 a week in groceries (for one person). I could work harder to bring that down but there are other places my budget could use the attention. Buying fresh, in season produce helps a lot. Also, a lot of dried goods last a long time.
"rillweid - Now with more TRD and less TDI" (rillweid)
11/21/2017 at 16:58, STARS: 1
Not sure if this is in your wheelhouse but if you still want to eat meat you could investigate either taking up hunting or finding someone to supply you with game meat. Hunting provides billions of dollars for conservation and on an idvidual basis helps prevent wildlife from meeting painful deaths as the hands of disease, starvation, cars, the government, etc.
https://www.outsideonline.com/2254781/hunters-fix-your-negligence-through-hard-work
You may hate hunting and I’m not trying to start fights on Oppo, but since you don’t seem opposed to eating animals I thought I would suggest it.
"Shamoononon drives like a farmer" (shamoononon)
11/21/2017 at 17:03, STARS: 1
Flank Steak????!!! You are a vegetarian.
"DipodomysDeserti" (dipodomysdeserti)
11/21/2017 at 17:04, STARS: 0
I was vegetarian for four years and my wife still is (10ish years now?). She’s definitely more hippy than me. Like, giving birth with no meds in our house, levels of hippy. We have our own chickens so that’s where we get our eggs, and I’ll buy meat from local ranchers, but it’s pretty expensive so I usually stick with vegetarian dishes.
Sounds like you already have it figured out with the beans dishes. That’s mostly what we make. I get the organic New Zealand cheese from TJs as I figure they probably treat ther cows better than most US dairy farms (and it’s delicious cheese). I just made some butternut squash and black bean enchiladas for dinner last night.
"RPM esq." (rpm3)
11/21/2017 at 17:08, STARS: 0
I will update as events warrant.
"Textured Soy Protein" (texturedsoyprotein)
11/21/2017 at 17:35, STARS: 0
We buy either Silk or Blue Diamond unsweetened almond coconut milk. Neither of us really use it much but I occasionally have a bowl of cereal with it. We don’t keep cereal in the house all the time. We also already were using Silk soy coffee creamer.
"Textured Soy Protein" (texturedsoyprotein)
11/21/2017 at 17:51, STARS: 0
I don’t object to all animal farming. My problem is with industrial-size animal farms. Things like battery caged hens, and grain-fed indoor dairy cows, are part of the reality of industrial animal agriculture. Those are not things I want to participate in.
There are plenty of good farms, which is why I started off with “unless you get eggs or dairy from farms you know treat their animals nicely.” I’d rather only get these products from farms where there’s some kind of confirmation of their animal-friendly practices, and not just eat whatever and assume that they might have been treated well.
For me it’s all about connection to where my food comes from. Which is why I have that link to the Cornucopia Institute , which is not a vegan agenda-pushing place, but does publicize information about good farming practices. With animal products only being a small part of my overall diet, I’m willing to spend a few bucks more on stuff from farms that make that information public.
"nermal" (nermal)
11/21/2017 at 17:54, STARS: 0
What about seafood?
How do you plan to get complete proteins and healthy fats?
"Textured Soy Protein" (texturedsoyprotein)
11/21/2017 at 17:59, STARS: 1
I thought about fish but decided that’s still killing an animal so I’m not going to eat it.
There are plenty of plant foods that contain complete proteins, or plenty of bean+grain combos that together make complete proteins. Meat is not necessary for complete proteins.
Same with healthy fats. My primary sources of fats were already things like olive oil, nuts and seeds. I’ll still use butter if it comes from cows I know were treated nicely.
"Textured Soy Protein" (texturedsoyprotein)
11/21/2017 at 18:00, STARS: 0
Um, I think you misread the part where I said “flesh of a dead animal.”
"Pickup_man" (zekeh)
11/21/2017 at 18:02, STARS: 0
I agree with all of that. I may have mistook your comment, I took it as you implying and assuming that the majority of farms mistreat their animals, when I have a vastly different experience, mainly being that those types of farms are in the minority. If that’s not what you meant I apologize, like I mentioned before, I grew up in a heavy Ag area, and have a lot of friends involved in the Ag industry. I’ve seen and heard a lot of misrepresentation, from both sides, and tend to take it a little personally sometimes.
Anyhow, work day is over! Have an awesome night!
"Textured Soy Protein" (texturedsoyprotein)
11/21/2017 at 18:03, STARS: 0
I feel about the same as I do about farmed meat where the animals are treated nicely. Sure they’re living a good life and being killed humanely, but you’re still killing them. I’m not on some crusade to stop that from ever happening but I don’t want to contribute to it. But like I said, if I were hosting thanksgiving, I might consider on that very limited occasion going to the hippy butcher.
I would happily melt everyone’s guns down if I had the chance.
"Textured Soy Protein" (texturedsoyprotein)
11/21/2017 at 18:29, STARS: 1
Like I mentioned, I’m in Wisconsin. I drive through multiple corn fields on my way to work, and that’s even though both my house and my office are within the city limits of Madison. I also really hate PETA-type crusaders. They’re insufferable.
There are a lot of factory farms. While they may not be actively abusive to animals, it’s not really something I want to put my dollars towards.
I do find some things about dairy farming in general to be a bit problematic. Keeping the cows producing milk requires breeding lots more cattle, and dairy cows often end up as beef cows long before their natural lifespan. Even ones that are let out to pasture and generally have a quality life, for the time they’re alive.
The thing is, we as humans have bred cattle for a long time for food so it’s not as if there’s a bunch of 20 year old cattle hanging around anywhere, but it’s just... ehh . Let’s just say I can see how people end up vegan because they just can’t bear to participate in any animal farming.
"R Saldana [|Oo|======|oO|] - BTC/ETH/LTC Prophet" (r-saldana)
11/21/2017 at 20:03, STARS: 0
I have been working toward this myself, but we had a baby so we have to keep ready access to meat based protein and dairy until about age 3. As of now I only eat one meal per day with a hippy meat product. Grass finished (not just grass fed there is a big difference) beef, rotationally grazed of course. But I too succumb to the pulled pork and carnitas readily available here in the south. The milk gathering process really bother me, forced rape of even the hippy organic animals so they can produce as much as possible for 3-5 years. The only way I will ever get around that is when we sell this house for a place with 5-6 acres So i can get a a couple head of cattle.
"R Saldana [|Oo|======|oO|] - BTC/ETH/LTC Prophet" (r-saldana)
11/21/2017 at 20:05, STARS: 0
I think the constant barrage of unsolicited advice towards health focused and partial vegetarian to full vegan folks is what has built the stereotype of the angry constantly professing vegan.
"TheRealBicycleBuck" (therealbicyclebuck)
11/21/2017 at 20:17, STARS: 0
I dated a vegetarian for a few years and as they say, if she’s a vegetarian, you’re a vegetarian. Those were some of the unhealthiest years of my life.
Once the switch is made, monitoring the diet is essential. It’s easy to be undernourished and surprisingly easy to overeat. Many of the vegetarian-friendly options are loaded with fats to make them more appealing to the palate.
When I finally broke up with the girl, I became a reformed vegetarian. The first thing I ate was a burger. It was the best burger of my life....
"Textured Soy Protein" (texturedsoyprotein)
11/21/2017 at 21:01, STARS: 1
My diet is already plant heavy including protein. I’m basically just subbing out more plant protein for the meat and still eating some ethical eggs and dairy. I am strong like bull, and shall remain so.
"rillweid - Now with more TRD and less TDI" (rillweid)
11/21/2017 at 21:01, STARS: 0
No I saw it. My reading of you’re post suggested that you were giving up meat because of poor animal treatment not because you didn’t like it. This led me to suggest this idea if you ever wanted to go down a humane meat route. Not trying to convince you of anything but I thought you might find this avenue of thought interesting.
I don’t have the ability to influence your life choices as an Internet comment, nor do I want to.
Please enjoy your new meat free lifestyle.
"Textured Soy Protein" (texturedsoyprotein)
11/21/2017 at 21:05, STARS: 0
Do you think me saying “flesh of a deaf animal” puts me in that category? I was just trying to matter-of-factly say why meat from a hunted animal is off the table for me.
"Textured Soy Protein" (texturedsoyprotein)
11/21/2017 at 21:20, STARS: 0
It’s pretty simple for me really, tasty as it may be, I’m just done eating things that have been killed. My preferences regarding treatment of animals is in the context of using them for their non-lethal products.
I understand the conservation aspects of certain hunting but it’s not my jam, nor am I judging hunters.
"AestheticsInMotion" (aestheticsinmotion)
11/22/2017 at 00:34, STARS: 0
Less a matter of price, more a matter of time. I love veggies, but good god. Put out 60 grams protein worth of vegetables next to the same of chicken/steak/eggs/etc. And you can eat the non-vegetarian dish in ten minutes whereas the vegetarian dish would take me over an hour. When I’m needing 200 grams of protein and triple that of carbs per day just to avoid losing weight, let alone putting on pounds.... All that time adds up!
But right on, good luck and curious to hear how it turns out. I occasionally go 100% no processed food, all organic primarily focusing on veggies and it’s amazing how much better I feel, sleep, breath... Eating to feel good and be healthy is a wonderful thing, but I always go back to eating for gains.
"Textured Soy Protein" (texturedsoyprotein)
11/22/2017 at 01:28, STARS: 0
I’ll still eat eggs and dairy from ethical sources, I’m not going full vegan.
But even with my heavy gym regimen, my calorie and protein requirements aren’t that high. If I were to ballpark it I’m probably at about 100g but I can go up from there. If I go consistently higher than that I’ll pack on weight.
In theory if I wanted/needed to hit 200g of protein, and do it vegan, there’s always assorted plant-based protein powders. No, plant protein isn’t necessarily absorbed as readily as stuff like whey, but I feel like I can hit what I need with plant protein.
(Meat is much more protein-dense than plants obviously, but actually a standard 14 oz block of tofu is about the same protein as 6 eggs, about 40g either way. Not that I’d want to get to 200g of protein with either 5 blocks of tofu or 30 eggs.)
"TomServo (Resides on the Satellite of Love)" (mk7silkblue)
11/27/2017 at 12:07, STARS: 0
Here’s the thing with hunting, if, say deer, weren’t hunted they would become overpopulated and starve themselves. I’m no hunter (I don’t eat much meat, and prefer Tofu prepped with peanut oil) but I enjoy wildlife, and an overpopulation could be a very bad thing.
"TomServo (Resides on the Satellite of Love)" (mk7silkblue)
11/27/2017 at 12:08, STARS: 0
I’m a semi-pro skeet shooter though, so I’ll have to disagree on the gun thing.