by "davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com" (davesaddiction)
Published 11/08/2017 at 09:02
by "davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com" (davesaddiction)
Published 11/08/2017 at 09:02
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STARS: 1
What is the max. grade allowed on a “normal” state highway? I love curvy roads like the one pictured, but clearly they’re not just building them like this for my enjoyment... Looks like 6% or 7% is max for U.S. interstates, apparently a street in SF has a 37% grade , but what’s the accepted limit for most states when it comes to their small highways? International folks: please chime in with the max. grades on similar roads in your area.
"xsnowpig" (xsnowpig)
11/08/2017 at 09:06, STARS: 0
https://www.codot.gov/travel/maximum-grades-on-colorado-mountain-passes.html
"PS9" (PS9)
11/08/2017 at 09:07, STARS: 3
That 37% grade means it time to make some CRRRRAAAAYYYZEEE MONEY! ALRIGHT HERE WE GO
YA YA YA YA YA * radical guitar riffs*
"Smallbear wants a modern Syclone, local Maple Leafs spammer" (smallbear94)
11/08/2017 at 09:09, STARS: 1
I don’t know the actual limits, but I’d imagine many roads like that one were at one point trails... animal trails turned native trails turned cart trails etc. And animals tend to choose the easiest path.
That’s just a random-ass idea though
"davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com" (davesaddiction)
11/08/2017 at 09:09, STARS: 0
Slumgullion looks fun!
"TheTurbochargedSquirrel" (thatsquirrel)
11/08/2017 at 09:12, STARS: 1
I have seen signs warning trucks about 8% grades and I feel like at one point I have seen a warning about 12%.
"PS9" (PS9)
11/08/2017 at 09:14, STARS: 2
Of all the animals in nature, the last one that should get a Turbocharger is a Squirrel. I feel like they get a permanent hit of crack in the womb.
"Tripper" (tripe46)
11/08/2017 at 09:15, STARS: 1
There’s an 2.x mile section on the way to my cabin in upstate PA that is an 18% grade. I have to leave the ranger in second and it barely makes it!
"TheTurbochargedSquirrel" (thatsquirrel)
11/08/2017 at 09:16, STARS: 0
Why do you think the tail is shaped the way it is?
"Steve is equipped with Electronic Fool Injection" (itsalwayssteve)
11/08/2017 at 09:21, STARS: 2
Canton Street in Pittsburgh actually has the 37% grade. A friend from high school lives in the Beechview neighborhood where the Audi commercial was filmed about a year and a half ago:
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There are a lot of streets in my old hometown with steep grades. Hystone Avenue in Johnstown - where my grandma lived - is pretty steep. On halloween the lady at the bottom of the hill (you’d be in her front yard if you were taking the street view picture) would give out apples and popcorn balls so of course the bastard kids who wanted candy would roll apples and popcorn balls from the top of the street.
"Demon-Xanth knows how to operate a street." (demon-xanth)
11/08/2017 at 09:24, STARS: 2
They try to be as low as reasonable. But frequently that limit can be far higher than desired. Note the road already having switchbacked around and going up to the right in this picture:
"davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com" (davesaddiction)
11/08/2017 at 09:25, STARS: 0
Haha - nice.
"Steve is equipped with Electronic Fool Injection" (itsalwayssteve)
11/08/2017 at 09:27, STARS: 0
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"davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com" (davesaddiction)
11/08/2017 at 09:28, STARS: 0
Nice - check the link, there’s a 37% in SF, too, but maybe not for as long as a stretch as Canton St.
"xsnowpig" (xsnowpig)
11/08/2017 at 09:30, STARS: 1
it is in one of the most beautiful sections of the mountains anywhere.
"davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com" (davesaddiction)
11/08/2017 at 09:31, STARS: 0
That’s crazy - it’s state highway or just a back road?
"davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com" (davesaddiction)
11/08/2017 at 09:35, STARS: 0
Arkansas 155
"Tripper" (tripe46)
11/08/2017 at 09:36, STARS: 2
State highway, rt 487 in PA near Rickets Glenn state park
"davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com" (davesaddiction)
11/08/2017 at 09:38, STARS: 1
I found an 18% in Arkansas, by a state park:
"davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com" (davesaddiction)
11/08/2017 at 09:41, STARS: 0
Sonora Pass in CA has a short section of 26%.
Why did Google attempt to fuzz out this 19% grade sign near Branson, MO?
"functionoverfashion" (functionoverfashion)
11/08/2017 at 09:42, STARS: 4
This can vary down to even the town level. My father was a surveyor in New Hampshire for around 30 years, and also a member of the fire department. I remember him repeatedly ranting about people not understanding just how steep 10% really is. And over 10%, generally, the towns wouldn’t like because fire trucks and other emergency vehicles would have trouble, in particular in the snow.
I also worked for a developer, and trying to build roads that could become town roads (and keep the fire department happy) was an interesting challenge. For example, the “limit” might be 10%, but they might rather see a very short section of 12%+ in order to allow a longer, gentler run-up to the short steep section. When you think about climbing a hill in snow, you are better off with varied grade than continuous, slightly-steeper-on-average grade. With infinite variations in between.
Then, there’s grandfathering. Much grandfathering. So many roads in existence now wouldn’t pass for new construction today.
"davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com" (davesaddiction)
11/08/2017 at 09:44, STARS: 1
There’s a road I love to drive in Arkansas where you have to look up over your shoulder to see where you’re going. =)
"davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com" (davesaddiction)
11/08/2017 at 09:46, STARS: 1
In some cases, this is probably true, but deer gladly climb and descend steep slopes that semis drivers wouldn’t even take a chance on.
"davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com" (davesaddiction)
11/08/2017 at 10:00, STARS: 1
Yup - definitely an interesting challenge with basically infinite variables! I studied civil engineering for 3 years before switching majors. I think there’s a few CE jobs I’d like, and many I’d really hate - ha!
"Demon-Xanth knows how to operate a street." (demon-xanth)
11/08/2017 at 10:01, STARS: 1
I grew up in the Sierra Nevada foothills half way between Sacramento and Tahoe. I had access to so many good roads that I miss it.
"davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com" (davesaddiction)
11/08/2017 at 10:02, STARS: 0
Oh yeah... I really wish I had stuff like this right in my backyard...
"Demon-Xanth knows how to operate a street." (demon-xanth)
11/08/2017 at 10:08, STARS: 2
The side effect of roads like this? Generally speaking, everyone was a good driver. You were forced to get good. Mistakes and distractions have such a vastly higher cost that stupid risks aren’t taken. Sure people drive fast compared to here in Virginia. But they aren’t yaking on a phone while they do it. They just drive. And do it well. There is a road near me that I take that adds a good five minutes to my commute, but I take it because it reminds me of the roads I used to drive every day. And it makes me feel good, comfortable, and alert. When I drive it, I don’t think about anything else. Just driving. It’s a wonderful feeling.
"Straightsix9904" (Straightsix9904)
11/08/2017 at 10:11, STARS: 1
There is a section of interstate near my hometown in West Virginia that is 7%. It is freakin steep! You can get a lot of speed off Sandstone Mountain and there is also a turn towards the bottom. It is sketchy in a light passenger car, I’d hate to do it in a semi.
"Eric @ opposite-lock.com" (theyrerolling)
11/08/2017 at 10:13, STARS: 1
I’m not sure on highways. The steepest one that I can think of was highway 22 as it drops into Jackson Hole. The steepest section of interstate highway I can think of is along I-5 in northern CA/southern OR south of Medford.
I used to live on a road that had some kind of ridiculous grade in a section of town where ridiculous grades were the norm. It was called “Dictionary Hill” in the suburbs of San Diego. I believe my road was around a 22% grade. There were numerous 22-28% grade roads up there, but the granddaddy was a 32% grade section of a road that was split a cliff into two pieces. The steepest section was paved in concrete...
"davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com" (davesaddiction)
11/08/2017 at 10:22, STARS: 2
20-30% grades are no big deal in a place where winter’s not a thing, I guess. =)
"davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com" (davesaddiction)
11/08/2017 at 10:23, STARS: 0
I don’t know how those guys do it in the steep/twisty stuff.
"awmaster10" (awmaster10)
11/08/2017 at 10:27, STARS: 1
Virginia drivers suck
"davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com" (davesaddiction)
11/08/2017 at 10:30, STARS: 2
I’m actually heading to NW Arkansas this weekend with a group of friends, just to drive on their great roads. It’s so much fun to get behind a local in a beater and follow along as they sail through windy sections at truly ridiculous speeds for the car/truck they’re driving.
I listened to a TED Talk yesterday about “flow”. This guy was talking about it in relation to meaningful work and a satisfying life, but the concept of flow is very much what I feel behind the wheel on a fun road. You can’t think of anything else than what you’re doing, and sometimes your hands and feet are reacting seemingly before your brain can pass along a command.
"Highlander-Datsuns are Forever" (jamesbowland)
11/08/2017 at 10:38, STARS: 1
It seems like 7% would be the max gradient on a modern state road, while 5-6% would be the max on a modern federal road like an interstate. 7% is quite steep in a car, anything over that and it would be very difficult to maintain any kind of reasonable highway speed. The road up to our local ski hill is 7-8% and it feels steep when it is covered in snow and ice. In the summer when dry sometimes I rally up the road and can maintain 50-60 mph in third gear without too much trouble.
"davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com" (davesaddiction)
11/08/2017 at 10:58, STARS: 0
Yeah, that sounds about right. I wonder if there’s any history of a state building a road in the past and then deciding it was just too steep and closing it altogether. Has to be hard to do once it’s there, I’m sure.
"Eric @ opposite-lock.com" (theyrerolling)
11/08/2017 at 14:30, STARS: 0
There’s a lot more to the story of why that development exists... If it wasn’t for the history involved, it wouldn’t exist and there certainly would not be long, straight, roads that ignore the topology entirely.
"davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com" (davesaddiction)
11/08/2017 at 15:04, STARS: 0
Can you share some of the history?
"Eric @ opposite-lock.com" (theyrerolling)
11/10/2017 at 03:08, STARS: 2
It’s named after a company that purchased an enormous plot of useless unbuildable land that was at the time deep in the eastern end of San Diego County. From an overhead map of the area, sight-unseen, they cut it into lots (nearly all are the same size - 50' wide and around 0.25 acres for the first ~1000 lots) and gave the lots away as a bonus for buying a set of encyclopedias, mostly to people that would never set foot on the land. Giving away cheap land was a fairly common ploy in consumer sales at the time. This is why the area has a nice square shape, perfectly straight streets, all roads are oriented north-south or east-west (some minor exceptions), and it makes no consideration for the topography of the area (the lowest point of the original property is in a valley near what is now Sweetwater Reservoir, while the highest point is near the top of a small mountain)...
From this article: http://legacy.sandiegouniontribune.com/uniontrib/20070105/news_2m5sunbelt.html
“Dictionary Hill in Spring Valley was originally called Lookout Mountain because of the impressive views, Fetzer notes. In 1910, the Interstate Realty and Improvement Co. bought 480 acres there. Anyone who bought a $109 set of encyclopedias got a parcel of land free. The area became known as Encyclopedia Heights, which somehow changed to Dictionary Hill. Most lot owners lost their land because of unpaid property taxes.”
The last bit is why some of the land ended up merged together, some reverted to the government (because it had no value whatsoever), and the lots get smaller as you go south (they were given away in order from left to right and top to bottom, until they did the lower half where they started with the left half and gave them away in the same order, but cut the lots smaller to get more out of them). I was told that the company sold most of the south-east quarter of the land in a big chunk when giving it away was no longer profitable, which is why that area doesn’t have straight streets but the area to the west does. You can see the unusual layout clearly from nearby SR125 and aerial images. You can also see that it extended further south by the perfect alignment of Sangamon Ave and Omega Street, the straightness of Grand Ave (the western limit), etc. Interestingly, when the La Presa region was built, it followed the same pattern established by the subdivision of this land, so almost the entire area is a grid with similarly-bizarre disregard for local topography.
"davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com" (davesaddiction)
11/10/2017 at 08:43, STARS: 1
That’s hilarious...
"RiceRocketeer Extraordinaire" (ricerocketeer2)
11/10/2017 at 11:15, STARS: 1
There’s a few 33% grade streets in LA but Baxter Street is particularly annoying/hilarious, depending on your point of view. It sits between two major roads that clog up often, so Waze/Google Maps will happily send you on the scenic route. Just make sure you’re not driving something too long, underpowered, or short on brakes.
https://www.theeastsiderla.com/2017/01/car-takes-a-tumble-echo-parks-steep-baxter-street/
"davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com" (davesaddiction)
11/10/2017 at 11:19, STARS: 0
Haha - wow!