by "JR1" (type35bugatti)
Published 09/22/2017 at 08:34
by "JR1" (type35bugatti)
Published 09/22/2017 at 08:34
No Tags
STARS: 2
When a 460hp car weighing less than 3400 pounds and hitting 60 in under 4 seconds is considered, “ underpowered ” by the new MotorTrend Best Driver’s Car. I am starting to wonder if these automotive journalist are just spoiled. I have a feeling most people have never and will never feel acceleration that fast.
"themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles" (themanwithsauce)
09/22/2017 at 08:47, STARS: 2
I understand it’s an eternity in 1/4 mile times, but the difference between the P100D and the grand sport’s 1/4 mile times are just 1.7 seconds. So outside of the lexus, all the cars were pretty competitive with one another. ANd it should be noted that other testers have gotten the corvette down in well under 12 seconds so there’s that too...
"Dark chocolate" (amghybridss)
09/22/2017 at 08:47, STARS: 2
Actually, you’re both right and wrong.
Remember how 300 hp was considered fast. When E55 AMG’s were in 470 range. that was 15 yrs ago. Dodge viper was at 500 hp.
Now they hit 600 plus.
The fact is, that, with so many options at 500 plus hp and so many sedans making their mark at 400 plus with just TT 6s and their performance variants eclipsing 550, the author can say it is under-powered.
On the other hand, there’s a whole lot of cars in the 200-300 hp range with the new advanced transmission and they seem to extract fair amount of performance. Imagine what a 460 hp V8 would feel in hands of those drivers.
I have a SS and it’s got plenty of power while it feels under-powered occasionally, I know I can still thunder past 99% of cars. On the other hand, I have a 7 series with “similar” power level and I feel it’s got more than enough power for its size. It is actually under-powered.
"sm70- why not Duesenberg?" (sm70-whynotduesenberg)
09/22/2017 at 08:50, STARS: 3
I guess when there’s another identical version with 650hp you get spoiled.
"Wheelerguy" (wheelerguy)
09/22/2017 at 09:08, STARS: 0
It isn’t underpowered. It’s geared wrong.
"JR1" (type35bugatti)
09/22/2017 at 09:22, STARS: 5
Regardless of if it is competitive or not the fact that 12.2 seconds is considered slow is almost laughable.
"JR1" (type35bugatti)
09/22/2017 at 09:26, STARS: 0
I guess so. The transmissions certainly have revolutionized everything. I was amazing the 718 beat the GS. Makes me wonder if MotorTrend would have done better with the 8 speed.
"davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com" (davesaddiction)
09/22/2017 at 09:26, STARS: 2
From experience, it’s incredibly easy to “normalize” to power. They are definitely spoiled for power, as I’m afraid I am at this point as well... 8.2 lbs per hp will do that to you. That GS would still feel fast to me, though, so there is hope for me yet.
I think the underpowered thing comes from driving a car with such a great chassis that it could take significantly more power. See also: any Boxster/Cayman, Miata, FR-S/BRZ/86...
"JR1" (type35bugatti)
09/22/2017 at 09:27, STARS: 0
How so?
"Wheelerguy" (wheelerguy)
09/22/2017 at 09:29, STARS: 1
Should have probably added an edit. THEY SAY it’s geared wrong; geared too tall.
"davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com" (davesaddiction)
09/22/2017 at 09:29, STARS: 0
With 450 hp in my E90 M3, after 5 years with the car, I actively have to resist the urge to look at used superchargers... I clearly need no more power, and I’m guessing the guys putting out 600 hp normalize to it quickly just like I have.
"JR1" (type35bugatti)
09/22/2017 at 09:29, STARS: 0
Well shit. I never want to get normalized to that much power. It takes the fun out of it all.
And I do think a sweet spot 500hp Stingray would be pretty fantastic but I don’t see Corvette doing that anytime soon unless they update the base Stingray to hit those numbers.
"davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com" (davesaddiction)
09/22/2017 at 09:30, STARS: 2
If someone’s buying this car for the drag strip, they’re doing it wrong anyway.
"davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com" (davesaddiction)
09/22/2017 at 09:31, STARS: 1
But but but! No limp mode at the track. ;-)
"DAWRX - The Herb Strikes Back" (karsonkinja)
09/22/2017 at 09:31, STARS: 0
We also live in a time where one can get a Shelby GT350 with 80% of the performance of the Grand Sport(and 50 more hp from a more exotic engine) for $10,000 less. Or you can get a Camaro ZL1 for around the same price that has 200 more horsepower. In that kind of environment its easy to get used to the idea that its under powered.
This is gonna be a weird comparison, but it’s like the criticism the BRZ/FRS/86 faces. “Underpowered”? Sure, in comparison to the price range. But they’re built for the purity of the drivers experience. And one could reason the same for the GS.
"davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com" (davesaddiction)
09/22/2017 at 09:37, STARS: 1
I think that’s why a lot of people with high powered cars have a “normal” daily they use, so whenever they get into their fun car, it’s a revelation. I daily mine, and don’t get me wrong, I enjoy it every damn day, but the sensation of power and speed is not the same as it was during the “honeymoon”. Like any drug, I suppose - you’re always trying to chase that first high.
FWIW, when I test drove a new Miata a while back, I enjoyed it plenty. Same with an Elise. Going lighter, lower & raw-er (more tactile) helps to mask the difference in outright performance, at least until you get beat off the line by a Camry - ha!
"JR1" (type35bugatti)
09/22/2017 at 09:44, STARS: 1
I think that is the best way to put it. The GS can handle and has more useable power for the streets.
"JR1" (type35bugatti)
09/22/2017 at 09:45, STARS: 1
Those Camry drivers can be pretty aggressive.
"Sweet Trav" (thespunbearing)
09/22/2017 at 09:48, STARS: 0
I still think the Grand Sport is the best all around car in that comparison. The Cayman is up there too.
"merged-5876237249235911857-hrw8uc" (merged-5876237249235911857-hrw8uc)
09/22/2017 at 09:49, STARS: 1
My past three cars are higher powered than typical and I can relate to your comment regarding chasing that honeymoon phase sensation. But I’ve also had those brief moments when I do a full power pull off a light or a spirited cornering attempt and subsequent power out of the corner, and I just feel a smile growing to an ear to ear grin, and I remember why I loved those cars.
It does get to be the norm, but then again, every once in a while, that spark is reignited and it’s wonderful.
"merged-5876237249235911857-hrw8uc" (merged-5876237249235911857-hrw8uc)
09/22/2017 at 09:51, STARS: 1
Amen.
"davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com" (davesaddiction)
09/22/2017 at 09:56, STARS: 1
I try to reignite it every morning. We just moved out to the country, and I get a few curves right away and then I’ve got time for my car to warm up and places to do a couple high-revving pulls before I get into civilization. And on mornings when it’s nice to have the windows down, it sure is enjoyable to rev-match downshifts with the concrete barrier on the highway reflecting it right into my ear holes... =)
"davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com" (davesaddiction)
09/22/2017 at 09:57, STARS: 0
What are your last three?
"ITA97, now with more Jag @ opposite-lock.com" (ita97)
09/22/2017 at 09:58, STARS: 1
Sure, they drive lots of fast cars, but the definition of fast has changed in these glorious times we live in. My 1/2 ton pickup truck that I drive to work in every day does 0-60 in just a tick over 5 seconds.
"If only EssExTee could be so grossly incandescent" (essextee)
09/22/2017 at 10:00, STARS: 1
I feel the sane way about the Toyabaru twins. 200hp is plenty enough oomph for a 1200kg car.
"merged-5876237249235911857-hrw8uc" (merged-5876237249235911857-hrw8uc)
09/22/2017 at 10:00, STARS: 0
You sir, are doing it right. :)
"JR1" (type35bugatti)
09/22/2017 at 10:05, STARS: 0
I second that nomination
"JR1" (type35bugatti)
09/22/2017 at 10:07, STARS: 0
Seriously? What truck?
"ITA97, now with more Jag @ opposite-lock.com" (ita97)
09/22/2017 at 10:39, STARS: 0
2017 F-150, regular cab/short bed/2wd/short gears and the 2.7 twin turbo ecoboost. Jalopnik and a couple of other publications tested low 5 second 0-60 times on the new F-150s with a crew cab/2wd/2.7 configuration. I’ve not actually put a stopwatch to mine, but it is probably 300 or 400 lbs lighter than the configuration that was tested.
By the seat of the pants, it is absolutely as fast as my old 93 LT1/6 speed corvette was, at least up to around 100mph where drag from its comparatively massive frontal area starts to catch up with it. From, say, 40-80 it feels faster than my vette was.
For another example, my sister’s car is base model 2016 Mustang, V-6 with the 6 speed manual. The 3.7 V6 is good for 300hp, and a 0-60 time in the mid 5's. That is a rental car spec new vehicle that she bought (I negotiated) off the lot for $21,700 (before taxes and such). A Focus ST, a (very good) FWD econobox with a turbo, will get you 0-60 in the 5's for about the same money.
"JR1" (type35bugatti)
09/22/2017 at 11:16, STARS: 1
Wow I didn’t realize the F150 could be that fast maybe they should bring back the F150 Lightening.
"Dark chocolate" (amghybridss)
09/22/2017 at 11:25, STARS: 1
My friend,
I can feel your emotions. I am looking to add a blower to my SS. Fortunately Money is not the problem. The LSA kit is like $7k. Only problem is I have had the car for less than 10 weeks with the ODO showing 1500 miles. 550 hp > 410 hp.
It’s an addiction. That’s the problem.
"davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com" (davesaddiction)
09/22/2017 at 11:46, STARS: 0
Hahaha - truly! I wrote this in response to someone else: I think that’s why a lot of people with high powered cars have a “normal” daily they use, so whenever they get into their fun car, it’s a revelation. I daily mine, and don’t get me wrong, I enjoy it every damn day, but the sensation of power and speed is not the same as it was during the “honeymoon”. Like any drug, I suppose - you’re always trying to chase that first high.
"merged-5876237249235911857-hrw8uc" (merged-5876237249235911857-hrw8uc)
09/22/2017 at 11:51, STARS: 1
2005 CTSV, 2012 S4 and my current daily, a 2009 S8. The S4 is the lowest powered one of the bunch, but it was an absolute blast to drive, but it got too small for use as any kind of a kid hauler.
"davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com" (davesaddiction)
09/22/2017 at 11:58, STARS: 1
I’m still making do hauling 3 kids in my E90 M3, but they’re only getting bigger...
"CaptDale - is secretly British" (captdale)
09/22/2017 at 11:59, STARS: 1
Well my Goat from the factory had 400 hp / 400 tq, weights 3725 lbs, and had a 4.7 0-60 and 14.1 1/4 mile.
And personally while I love the acceleration, I want/need more.
"JR1" (type35bugatti)
09/22/2017 at 12:46, STARS: 0
That is about a two seconds slower than the Vette though through the 1/4 so that at least makes a little more sense.
"ITA97, now with more Jag @ opposite-lock.com" (ita97)
09/22/2017 at 13:11, STARS: 1
The ecoboost engines are pretty impressive. Even the small 2.7l V6 makes 325hp and 400ft/lbs of torque. Combine that with taking 700 or so pounds of the truck by switching to an aluminum body, and they start to get quick. If someone had told me that the first aluminum bodied, twin-turbo charged vehicle I own would be a pickup truck, I would’ve never believed them until I bought one this year.
"merged-5876237249235911857-hrw8uc" (merged-5876237249235911857-hrw8uc)
09/22/2017 at 15:43, STARS: 1
Yeah, my boys are all still in child seats, the youngest, rear facing. The middle son would get stuck behind me and just barely fit his legs behind my seat. As they age out of the seats, it won’t be so bad, until they get much much bigger. But that’s a ways off for now. My cars aren’t so much for family hauler duty anyway, but they need to work in a pinch. Definitely like the big bodied audi for now, but it’s not nearly as good a go-cart as the S4 was. That little car was a great sized vehicle for dicing up traffic. I imagine your M3 is similar in feel, if not more nimble.
"davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com" (davesaddiction)
09/23/2017 at 16:32, STARS: 1
Yeah, I’m the same - infrequent, but frequent enough I can’t have a 2-seater for a long time.
I do love the size of my car. Big enough, but not big.
"merged-5876237249235911857-hrw8uc" (merged-5876237249235911857-hrw8uc)
09/23/2017 at 20:23, STARS: 1
2 seaters are over rated anyway, that just means you don’t have enough friends or loved ones ;)
"davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com" (davesaddiction)
09/24/2017 at 14:13, STARS: 0
Haha, but so small & light & potentially mid-engined!