by "Wobbles the Mind" (wobblesthemind)
Published 06/22/2017 at 19:51
by "Wobbles the Mind" (wobblesthemind)
Published 06/22/2017 at 19:51
Tags: Thoughts
STARS: 0
I think we are too slow to react, too stubborn to adapt, and too self-obssessed to anticipate changes. I haven’t flushed out my thoughts yet but I definitely feel extremely favorable towards 16 year olds voting. I also think by 14 years of age we need to have these young teens involved and fully represented in commerce and consumerism.
I haven’t organized all the perspectives and surface arguments or even gone over my exact beliefs yet. All I know is that we are doing things too late and are forgetting that many things are taught through experience and education is a powerful supplement.
I’ll think this stuff over. My real issue comes from observing and experiencing (especially online) how few within my generation and probably many older ones missed out on understanding interdependence. However, I’m seeing preteens and teens cultivating or at least favoring an interdependent network which makes me feel as if they are moving ahead of where we with lawful privelege currently reside.
I figure out my exact perspective, organize it, and share it with you all after I go over some arguments with myself. Then I’ll open up the flood gates with your feedback and reevaluate my stance.
"jimz" (jimz)
06/22/2017 at 20:07, STARS: 13
I don’t think so. Teens are too irrational, too quick to fall in with groupthink and/or knee-jerk contrarianism to be added to the voter rolls.
sorry, but it’ll take an enormous effort to change my view. The amount of idiocy I hear pouring out of the mouths of the average 14-17 year old is enough to reinforce that.
"Daily Drives a Dragon - One Last Lap" (ddadragon)
06/22/2017 at 20:07, STARS: 2
Not saying it’s bad but what do children do? Yep. They believe whatever their parents do
"Verdog ~ manual Bro, Bro - HellHawk Equipped" (verdog)
06/22/2017 at 20:10, STARS: 5
Ehhh, we need responsible working people voting. I would say 23 and with a college degree. The more educated the better. I have a 14 y/o and she thinks her phone is a privilege and I am evil when I take it away.
My daughter actually said I can’t make her work due to labor laws... they taught her this. I had a p/t job at 12 loading hay in a field.
"jkm7680" (jkm7680)
06/22/2017 at 20:16, STARS: 2
No. Just no.
We don’t need more uninformed voters.
"RacinBob" (racinbob)
06/22/2017 at 20:23, STARS: 7
What do you get when a fourteen year old votes...
Pollution ewe...
Everybody should have what I have.....
Army why...
Stop being so mean....
The real world is tough. Until you have skin in the game (i.e. Eligible for draft, likely to pay taxes) you shouldn’t get to set the rules.... If fourteen year old’s got to vote, it’s another step towards the worst combination of France and Chicago. No thanks.
"Bytemite" (bytemite)
06/22/2017 at 20:43, STARS: 2
How about a competency test that gives you a voter’s license.
This way you don’t exclude people for a meaningless number like age.
We need a license to drive, license to teach, license to own guns, license to sell, yet anyone can have a say where our money goes and who has the nuke codes?
Get the Cletus’ out of the voting booths and we can finally make some progress.
"Wacko" (wacko--)
06/22/2017 at 20:45, STARS: 1
16 is way too young to vote, even 18 is too young. I know I was once that age and thought I had enough wisdom, and maturity. Now that I am 20 years older than that you realize that. I would keep it at 18.
"TorqueToYield" (torquetoyield)
06/22/2017 at 21:07, STARS: 1
I’ve met extremely mature 16 year olds that have dealt with some serious shit and take care of their entire family.
I’ve also known some horrible immature 65 year olds who think they’re still 14, take no responsibility for anything and never progressed past middle school state of mind.
18 for voting or whatever, wow so adult now, is arbitrary, and I’m pretty ambivalent.
I will say that I think it’s fucked up you can fight, kill, and die for the military at 18 but not have a beer.
"415s30 W123TSXWaggoIIIIIIo ( •_•))°)" (415s30)
06/22/2017 at 21:54, STARS: 0
I liked following the French election, we should do it like that.
"jimz" (jimz)
06/22/2017 at 22:38, STARS: 1
until they’re 13, then they might flip and believe the exact opposite of what their parents do.
"jimz" (jimz)
06/22/2017 at 22:41, STARS: 1
Get the Cletus’ out of the voting booths and we can finally make some progress.
we don’t need to get “Cletus” out of the voting booth, we need to get the 70 year old white fucks out because all they do is vote against things which scare them.
which is fucking everything.
"Shoop" (shoopdawoop993)
06/22/2017 at 22:52, STARS: 0
You only like them voting because they’re on your side.
"Shoop" (shoopdawoop993)
06/22/2017 at 22:54, STARS: 3
Wow, really? Literacy tests to be able to vote? Yeah that’s gone over real well before.
"Bytemite" (bytemite)
06/22/2017 at 23:05, STARS: 1
What’s wrong with that? The literacy rate in this country is high enough to include almost everyone anyway. Plus it’s not just literacy, it should be a standardized test of basic knowledge of our history and very basic life skills (arithmetic, reading comprehension, writing).
"AdverseMartyr" (ewilliamson)
06/22/2017 at 23:09, STARS: 1
Well, as you should be able to at least fill out your ballot accurately and (even more importantly) know what you are voting on, and since the only way to actually know that is to read the stances of candidates on issues (because audio sound bites don’t actually tell you a candidates position on all the issues) then yes, it does actually make sense to know if someone can at least read and fill out a ballot.
"AdverseMartyr" (ewilliamson)
06/22/2017 at 23:11, STARS: 0
Teens are awash in hormones that in some cases can put them on the verge of insanity, and they levels are always changing.
Add to that the intensity of peer pressure (or the cute someone you really want to get into bed) and the likely-hood of voting based off of personal opinion could be fairly low.
"Baeromez" (Baeromez)
06/23/2017 at 00:04, STARS: 4
The human frontal cortex isn’t fully developed until age 25. This is the part of the brain responsible for long-term decision making and high level conceptual thinking.
I’m don’t know how old you are, Wobbles, and I wouldn’t judge you or your arguments based on age, but almost everyone gets smarter in their twenties. It’s a biological fact.
The problem is that as each generation surpasses the previous in intelligence and knowledge, it can seem like older people aren’t as smart or are behind the times; which is actually true.
Even though a 16 year old now is likely to be much more educated that an 18 year old fifty years ago, doesn’t mean we shouldn’t wait until that 16 year old is closer to maturity (and their own full mental potential) before letting them make decisions that affect the rest of us.
"Baeromez" (Baeromez)
06/23/2017 at 00:05, STARS: 2
Just because someone is stupid doesn’t mean they shouldn’t have a say.
"Hammerdown" (hammerdown32)
06/23/2017 at 10:27, STARS: 0
This election finally made me get involved enough to where I’ll vote in the next election. I’m 28. I just never felt strongly enough either way to go form my own opinion and choose a candidate.
It’s a utopic dream, but I would love to see political candidates put out a two page summary of their campaign platform, a comparison of where they stand on the big issues, and two debates. No twitter, no ads, so campaigning. Unfortunately, with social media and 24 hour news we’re going the opposite way.
If 16 yr olds are being educated on current government topics while being allowed to form their own opinions and vote if they choose, I’d be for it. However, if it’s like my highschool everyone will ask who everyone voted for. Vote for a candidate that nobody else likes and get made fun of. I’d say leave it at 18.
As for the comments about a literacy test and getting the 70 yr olds out of the voting booths, idk what the answer is. I think the biggest issue right now is how lopsided the population is. Almost 40% of the population is over the age of 55. With people living longer, they’re voting in more elections . Younger people don’t even them out as easily. Generally speaking, I think older people tend to be more conservative. However, if Medicaid and Social Security stumble under this administration it will be interesting to see how they vote next time. Changing the voting process or limiting who can vote will never happen. It’s a constitutional right, so that makes it extremely hard to change.
"Hammerdown" (hammerdown32)
06/23/2017 at 10:27, STARS: 0
They usually are the first to get fucked over, so yea, they deserve a say if they choose to have one.
"Hammerdown" (hammerdown32)
06/23/2017 at 10:29, STARS: 1
This is a great post on this issue.
"Chuckles" (chucklesw37)
06/23/2017 at 11:32, STARS: 0
Creating a fair standardized test is incredibly difficult. I had a friend who spent years designing tests for employers to use to screen candidates, and he told me how nearly every test ends up favoring somebody. The things that you and I consider basic knowledge might not be essential to someone else. Even if it wasn’t your intention to exclude a particular group, you might inadvertently create a test that is favorable to people who had similar life experiences to you.
"LongbowMkII" (longbowmkii)
06/23/2017 at 12:57, STARS: 0
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Literacy_test
"Rock Bottom" (rockbottom81)
06/23/2017 at 14:34, STARS: 0
If anything, the voting age needs to be raised.
The younger you are, the less you know of the world and how it works, and the more likely you are to be dazzled by BS that you desperately want to believe is true (looking at you, Charles Manson groupies). Sure, most 14- to 25-year-olds think they know what’s going on, but the reality is that they are living on the “Peak of Mount Stupid” on the Dunning-Kruger Curve. As a calibration point, I’m 36 and only recently recognized that I’m deep in the “Valley of Despair”, despite being a reasonably successful engineer with “jet aerodynamicist” and “NASA engineer” on his resume. If I currently have doubts about my own ability to make good political and life choices, then 14-year-old Rock Bottom was downright terrifying and we should all thank our lucky stars he wasn’t able to cause more damage than he did!
For reference: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
Dunning and Kruger’s research indicates that incompetent people will:
- Fail to recognize their own lack of skill
- Fail to recognize the extent of their inadequacy
- Fail to accurately gauge skill in others, and
- Recognize and acknowledge their lack of skill only after being exposed to formal training in that skill
"brianbrannon" (brianbrannon)
06/23/2017 at 15:32, STARS: 0
The brain isn’t fully developed till 25. So why let unfinished brains make decisions?