by "marshknute" (marshknute)
Published 06/16/2017 at 10:00
by "marshknute" (marshknute)
Published 06/16/2017 at 10:00
No Tags
STARS: 1
The worst kind of car enthusiast is the kind of person who says shit like, “If you haven’t owned one, then you clearly don’t know what you’re talking about. Oh, and all the reviews are wrong, this car is actually amazing. Source: I own one”
Anyway, I made a comment about the 911 Turbo S being a fantastic car, but boring as shit. Subsequently, some guy claiming to own a TT-S replied by calling me an idiot and the car reviewer also an idiot for posting a negative review.
After some confusion, he clarified that he actually owns a Turbo S, which he calls a TT-S despite the striking similarities in spelling to the Audi TT-S. Anyway, his argument was that, because I’ve never driven a Turbo, I couldn’t possibly have an informed opinion on it.
Now, first-hand experience is never a bad thing, but you can absolutely have an informed opinion without it, as long as you’ve done your research. That’s like saying to a Veterenarian, “you’re not a dog, so how could you possibly know anything about dogs?” Nevermind the video in question concluded with the reviewer saying the Turbo was too boring to be considered a supercar thanks to its crap exhaust note and understated interior/exterior styling. Still a fantastic sportscar, and just as fast as any supercar, just boring compared to a 570S or R8.
Now, my “experience” with the Turbo is secondhand, but it’s always the same story: someone joins the Porsche Club and signs up for HPDE with their new 911 Turbo. After the first year, you never see them again. They’re the car equivalent of new gym members with a New Years resolution. They’re decked out in expensive new sneakers, and they inevitably disappear within the first month, never to be seen again.
Occasionally, they do come back, but they ALWAYS have a GT3 instead. Why the unanimous change of heart? The Turbo is too quiet, too heavy, and too prone to understeer. The GT3 may technically be slower without the extra power and AWD, but it’s a way more satisfying and thrilling track car.
But ignoring all that, my original comment simply said the Turbo was boring. One visit to the local Cars & Coffee will corroborate my claim; nobody will give a Turbo a second glance or ask you to rev its engine. But every carspotter will break out the cameras for an R8 or 570S because they’re actually exciting supercars.
But what do I know? I don’t own one.
"Azrek" (azrek)
06/16/2017 at 10:08, STARS: 3
I have a different issue at work and with friends. I am the ONLY enthusiast.
So folks will occasionally come to me stating, “I have $45k and I want a fun sporty 4 door car!”
Sure thing! I will price out some cars in their range with the options the wanted, but then the following weekend they show up in a Camry or a 2 door pickup truck.
Why did you ask me for info on cars if you clearly aren’t interested?!
I now caveat my help with, “Look...I like cars...I really really like cars. If you see a car as a tool; then ask someone else for assistance.”
"Mercedes Streeter" (smart)
06/16/2017 at 10:10, STARS: 5
The worst kind of car enthusiast is the kind of person who says shit like, “If you haven’t owned one, then you clearly don’t know what you’re talking about. Oh, and all the reviews are wrong, this car is actually amazing. Source: I own one”
Well, prepare to be mad at me! :D Sorta, your situation is way different. :P
I adore the people who love to say the smart fortwo is garbage and any person who buys one is quote, ‘retarded’.
I ask them “have you driven one?” and their response is usually “for a test drive” or “no”. Ah, so their entire opinion on this car is based on Internet infamy and reading negative reviews, cool. Yet, if you ask anyone who has lived with one for an extended amount of time and they’ll usually tell you the car is just fine. A 5 minute test drive doesn’t make one an authority on if a car is good or bad...
This also applies to other issues in life. I like being told my unique experience is wrong by folks who aren’t living anything near the experience. Well I mean how would you know? You never experienced it before and never will! Some things you can’t research in a book. :)
"G_Body_Man: Sponsored by the number 3" (gbodyman)
06/16/2017 at 10:14, STARS: 1
I don’t get all the hate surrounding the Fortwo. Sure, the transmission on the previous gen was hyper mega awful when it came to starting and stopping on hills, but the new one is solid to drive and makes a purring, growly, french-influcenced noise. It’s a shame they’re going all electric.
"benjrblant" (benjblant)
06/16/2017 at 10:14, STARS: 4
Knowledge without experience is just information.
"marshknute" (marshknute)
06/16/2017 at 10:14, STARS: 2
Whenever I’m in that situation, I just ask them, “what car were you thinking of buying? Well, that’s the car you should buy.”
They only asked you because they wanted confirmation. If you tell them otherwise, then they’ll just say you’re an idiot who has weird taste in cars.
"404 - User No Longer Available" (toni-cipriani)
06/16/2017 at 10:14, STARS: 3
You mean like how the Juke is the best crossover compact ever, and everyone is wrong, right?
"Demon-Xanth knows how to operate a street." (demon-xanth)
06/16/2017 at 10:15, STARS: 1
I readily accept that even among enthusiasts, tastes differ greatly. I’ve watched enough superspeederrob videos to know that he and I have great differences on cars. He’s not wrong, and I’m not wrong. We just like different flavors.
I drove my cousin’s ‘06 GTO, yet I preferred my ‘02 Dakota. Any magazine I can think of that sticks to pavement would have considered my opinion bat shit insane. But I enjoyed being able to hammer on roads and smack the tires around more. It just fit me better. Doesn’t make the GTO a bad car, because clearly they are quite good. Just not the right one for me.
"Smallbear wants a modern Syclone, local Maple Leafs spammer" (smallbear94)
06/16/2017 at 10:15, STARS: 2
Counterpoint: this thing is awesome and if you think otherwise you’re wrong because you don’t own one.
Seriously though... I get both sides of this. It comes down to what you think is most important in a vehicle, above all else. Some like refinement. Some like quality. Some like comfort. Some like looks. Some like speed. I like character, and this thing has it in spades.
So you’re not wrong if you think it’s shit, I’m not wrong if I think it’s awesome, ownership definitely gives you a more valid platform to preach from, but to say your opinion is invalid UNLESS you own one is idiotic.
"Wagonlife740" (wagonlife740)
06/16/2017 at 10:15, STARS: 1
That color! The two-tone interior!
"marshknute" (marshknute)
06/16/2017 at 10:20, STARS: 1
I know the previous Smart got a lot of flack for its transmission, but I thought the current one was pretty well received. I’d love to own a manual one in that goofy orange/black color combo. Also, my biggest impressions of the Smart come from Salomondrin, who loves the thing to death despite owning a gagillion supercars.
The thing is, I wasn’t even criticizing the 911 Turbo’s performance or dynamic ability. Just that it isn’t as exciting as the competition, which I don’t think is a bold claim by any means.
"Mercedes Streeter" (smart)
06/16/2017 at 10:24, STARS: 0
Yeah yours is a different situation as far as I could see. It’s more subjective to yourself and not just like outright hateful for no reason. lol
"Daily Drives a Dragon - One Last Lap" (ddadragon)
06/16/2017 at 10:25, STARS: 1
I probably wouldn’t like a smart but I haven’t driven one so....
"Mercedes Streeter" (smart)
06/16/2017 at 10:26, STARS: 0
Thankfully that’s only in the USA/Canada, but yeah it does suck that the road ends here. The 453 could have been wonderful if Mercedes-Benz USA bothered to try. No advertising, limited dealer network, unhelpful dealers...they shot themselves in the foot!
"Chuckles" (chucklesw37)
06/16/2017 at 10:27, STARS: 1
I remember my only issue with them when they came out was the price. I thought that they would have been wildly popular at a lower price point, but priced where they were you had a lot of options with more space and practicality.
"marshknute" (marshknute)
06/16/2017 at 10:27, STARS: 0
What is the current Oppo climate surrounding the Juke? I know they LOATHED it when it came out, but I thought it was generally pretty popular in recent months? I’ve always thought it was a fun little crossover.
EDIT: it occurs to me that I might have only read your articles about your Juke and just assumed everyone on Oppo likes it!
"Smallbear wants a modern Syclone, local Maple Leafs spammer" (smallbear94)
06/16/2017 at 10:34, STARS: 0
Not alone. I tried a friend’s ‘16 Golf R... Prefer my truck.
"Chan - Mid-engine with cabin fever" (superchan7)
06/16/2017 at 10:35, STARS: 3
The only thing an owner has over a journalist is the actual ownership and maintenance experience.
I cannot speak to the performance of my F355 as compared to its competitors or as compared to newer Ferraris. How loose is the tail at the limit if you lift? Is the 0-60 really as advertised? Is the turn-in worse than a Porsche 993 Turbo? I’m not good enough of a driver to tell, nor have I driven comparison cars back-to-back.
What I am qualified to judge is the ownership costs and common problems.
Oh, and if you think any road car sounds better than the F355, Yer Wrong!!!11
"Frenchlicker" (frenchlicker)
06/16/2017 at 10:35, STARS: 1
People only want an enthusiasts advice hoping they will reaffirm what they want. That’s the problem I’m currently having with my girlfriend searching for a car I despise the car she wants but I told her to go ahead and get it. But she has a little bit of apprehension to do that because she thinks I’ll complain if anything goes wrong.
"Azrek" (azrek)
06/16/2017 at 10:36, STARS: 1
I always saw it as a chance to get away from their typical boring cars...but now I realize they use the car to get from A to B and that is it. They don’t care if it is fast, slick, have flappy paddles or launch control.
I still have an odd taste in cars, but they always want me to drive to lunch as I have the best car in the lot.
"crowmolly" (crowmolly)
06/16/2017 at 10:37, STARS: 0
There’s no reason for him to be a dickhole and say “if you don’t own one you don’t understand” like ownership is an instant download of all of the required data needed to form a complete opinion. That’s crap.
Conversely, all of the reading and watching in the world can’t give you a complete opinion either.
"benjrblant" (benjblant)
06/16/2017 at 10:53, STARS: 3
PINTO IS BEST CAR EVER. ALL OTHERS WRONG.
(=
"Smallbear wants a modern Syclone, local Maple Leafs spammer" (smallbear94)
06/16/2017 at 10:56, STARS: 1
NO I HAVEN’T HAD ONE BUT CAN SAY WITH ABSOLUTE AUTHORITYIT’S NOT
"Future next gen S2000 owner" (future-next-gen-s2000-owner)
06/16/2017 at 11:00, STARS: 2
I kinda agree with random internet TT-S owner. I think you truly need to drive a car to fully understand it. It’s like eating a sandwhich. You can read all the reviews online but until you try it, you don’t really know. Maybe it’s just me but I’d be more swayed buy those that spent cash on a new car over those that just review them.
Or maybe I’m an idiot. Who knows.
"marshknute" (marshknute)
06/16/2017 at 11:05, STARS: 1
I find it inherently irresponsible to value the opinion of a single owner over the opinion of an automotive journalist who has driven all the competition (often back to back). Not to mention the constant stream of former Turbo owners turned GT3 owners.
"Azrek" (azrek)
06/16/2017 at 11:14, STARS: 0
I described their car as a “Soul-less piece of shit” in my outside voice
So hopefully the message was received.
My girlfriend brought me to look for cars, but I already knew she wanted something practical. She just wanted to ensure it wasn’t a POS. I got free lunch outta it.
"Tripper" (tripe46)
06/16/2017 at 11:22, STARS: 0
Guy sounds like a douche, and I don’t believe you have to own a car to have a real opinion on it. I do believe that you have to have driven a car to get out of the “armchair critic” category.
"Frenchlicker" (frenchlicker)
06/16/2017 at 11:22, STARS: 1
You are correct on the soulless piece of shit. I looked at cars similar to it and they seem better equipped and better looking for the same price. Also I get a Jeep support vehicle out of whatever she gets, haha.
"Chan - Mid-engine with cabin fever" (superchan7)
06/16/2017 at 13:56, STARS: 1
This is a good life hack. I have made a habit of asking, “did you have anything in mind to try first?”
There aren’t really very many BAD cars now. If someone is dead set on, say, a Dodge Journey, then I would ask them if they had considered any competitors.
"gmporschenut also a fan of hondas" (gmporschenut)
06/17/2017 at 00:22, STARS: 1
Today a co-worker went on and on about how Mclarens are so much mroe dangerous than a Ferrari.?!?!? they’re also 1/2 the price of a Ferarri ?!??!