by "HammerheadFistpunch" (hammerheadfistpunch)
Published 04/26/2017 at 10:00
by "HammerheadFistpunch" (hammerheadfistpunch)
Published 04/26/2017 at 10:00
Tags: Cars I do hate
STARS: 5
I hate the idea of ultra high performance SUV’s.
Look I get there is a facet of silly fun to them, and I get that some people want (or need) the advantages of SUV’s but want them to go really fast...and I understand its not about the capability its about showing that you can piss away money on silly things...I still think taking a vehicle primarily built to be rugged and utilitarian to its antithetical conclusion is stupid.
I don’t really care that you think its cool because its not supposed to happen, like mango in salsa or bacon in shakes this is just wrong.
People ask me: you hate the G-wagon? NO! I love the G-wagon, I think its one of the best anachronistic novelties around and I have boundless respect for what it can do in environments it was meant to inhabit. The AMGification of the G is perverse though, as are, in my humble opinion, all track focused off road platforms.
Why? The simple and unpopular answer among fans of these things is this: cause it makes the company money. There are enough people out there with the right alignment of cash to burn, uninhibited vanity, and an appetite for anarchy that companies can mark monronies to the moon and thats before you add color matched seatbelt stitching.
They say money ruins people, cars too.
"sm70- why not Duesenberg?" (sm70-whynotduesenberg)
04/26/2017 at 10:06, STARS: 4
"Azrek" (azrek)
04/26/2017 at 10:08, STARS: 1
Now I am a fan of some of the fast SUVs such as the Macan. It is basically a hot hatch that is raised up a tad.
"Highlander-Datsuns are Forever" (jamesbowland)
04/26/2017 at 10:10, STARS: 4
I hate the AMG too but I’m behind things like the typhoon and srt Jeep Grand Cherokee.
"HammerheadFistpunch" (hammerheadfistpunch)
04/26/2017 at 10:12, STARS: 0
Well a Macan would be as out of place on a trail as a g63 is on a twisty mountain road. It’s, as you said, just a tall hatch under the “light truck” EPA loophole
"PS9" (PS9)
04/26/2017 at 10:17, STARS: 2
SUVs are supposed to be rugged off road vehicles, but for most people in the US, they’re not gonna be used like that. Making a giant SUV fast like a car sounds dumb, until we consider that an SUV today is just a larger car. For all their capability that could be exploited on a trail, the bulk of them will be doing mall parking lot duty at best. The toughest overlanding job they’ll face is overcoming that yellow bit of concrete marking the end of the parking lot the owner didn’t remember was there before gunning it.
If all the buyer is going to do with their SUV is shopping and soccer practice, then why not make it more car like? Why not a softer suspension, road noise deadening panels, and an independent rear suspension? Why not a powerful engine? You could argue that a car-like SUV dilutes what an SUV is supposed to be, but that’s what buyers what an SUV to be; a giant car.
"DanimalHouse" (thrillerwa09)
04/26/2017 at 10:18, STARS: 0
This is still worse:
The ONLY redeeming thing about the W163 ML was that it was featured in Jurassic Park - albeit,
The Lost World
, which was not a great sequel.
"Azrek" (azrek)
04/26/2017 at 10:19, STARS: 0
Oh I agree to that. I had a friend get a 2WD 4Runner that was $40k. I told him he’d never take that out in the woods as it was too valuable, so I didn’t get the point other than having a giant grocery getter.
"Frenchlicker" (frenchlicker)
04/26/2017 at 10:21, STARS: 0
Power oriented I would say. If they were supposed to be performance oriented they messed up. Looking at them solely as hp, tire shredding beasts I have no problem.
"Ash78, voting early and often" (ash78)
04/26/2017 at 10:21, STARS: 0
I just don’t get the current 4Runner. It’s like $10k overpriced, but sells like crazy. I make exceptions for people using them offroad, but it’s a catch 22 because taking a brand new $45k vehicle offroad is pretty nutty.
"davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com" (davesaddiction)
04/26/2017 at 10:22, STARS: 1
As much as it pained me to see Porsche come out with the Cayenne, I think the Macan is pretty sweet and would absolutely own one.
"Wrong Wheel Drive (41%)" (rduncan5678)
04/26/2017 at 10:24, STARS: 0
The only vehicles I actually hate are crossovers. They are impractical and just look like poo. But for some reason, the masses love them. I am happy that they are slowly turning back into wagons again since that looks way better.
Performance SUVS are just cool as hell. That SRT-8 Cherokee makes me giggle uncontrollably when I see one. Honestly I get more pissed off seeing regular Wranglers and other off-road worthy vehicles just being daily driven on pavement with big knobby tires and such. Just because they are not being used. At least the performance oriented ones are being driven fast as intended (although I doubt on a track much).
"benjrblant" (benjblant)
04/26/2017 at 10:29, STARS: 0
How does one explain bump steer to a customer purchasing a 220,000USD vehicle?
"Smallbear wants a modern Syclone, local Maple Leafs spammer" (smallbear94)
04/26/2017 at 10:30, STARS: 2
fite meh
"Busslayer" (Busslayer)
04/26/2017 at 10:36, STARS: 0
I don't think lots of power takes away from the ruggedness or utilitarian values of a good SUV. There is no reason you can't be fast and rugged. I do agree that lowering springs and low profile tires on a SUV is stupid since they remove the raison d'etre . If handling prowess is the goal, you are fighting the current by starting with a SUV.
"DipodomysDeserti" (dipodomysdeserti)
04/26/2017 at 10:38, STARS: 0
What about this one?
"HammerheadFistpunch" (hammerheadfistpunch)
04/26/2017 at 11:04, STARS: 0
“If all the buyer is going to do with their SUV is shopping and soccer practice, then why not make it more car like?”
They have made them more carlike, they are called crossovers and some of these tall wagons are very fast. Don’t start with an off road platform first and then go car second. Go car platform first and built in a little suv.
"HammerheadFistpunch" (hammerheadfistpunch)
04/26/2017 at 11:04, STARS: 0
its true. That was that cars 15 minutes of fame.
"PS9" (PS9)
04/26/2017 at 11:11, STARS: 0
Some people don’t want a little SUV that used to be a car. They want something with rugged capability they’re never gonna use. Is that a good thing? I don’t think so. Will the auto industry turn those people and their money away? All the water on earth would turn to maple sap before that.
"HammerheadFistpunch" (hammerheadfistpunch)
04/26/2017 at 11:13, STARS: 1
Go back and retro price the 4runner, its not as expensive as it used to be and you get an awful lot more.
"HammerheadFistpunch" (hammerheadfistpunch)
04/26/2017 at 11:16, STARS: 1
You tell them the steering is “ballin”. They’ll assume you mean it in the urban dictionary sense, what you mean is that the recirculating ball steering is crappy and its doing its thing.
"HammerheadFistpunch" (hammerheadfistpunch)
04/26/2017 at 11:16, STARS: 0
Thats the meat of the argument.
"HammerheadFistpunch" (hammerheadfistpunch)
04/26/2017 at 11:17, STARS: 0
Like all Jeep concept vehicles, this one is just for show.
"Ash78, voting early and often" (ash78)
04/26/2017 at 11:17, STARS: 0
True, but retro price declines apply to a lot of cars. They
’
re almost like consumer electronics (Moore
’
s Law), but not as extreme. I
’
m not saying I don
’
t like them, I
’
m just always underwhelmed
—
especially for people who buy them for 100% on
-
road use. They
’
re so incredibly common where I live. I honestly believed the recent revisions to Highlander would have cut down on their popularity, but still going strong. And holding value really well.
"HammerheadFistpunch" (hammerheadfistpunch)
04/26/2017 at 11:22, STARS: 0
money talks...and sometimes its annoying.
"Rico" (ricorich)
04/26/2017 at 11:43, STARS: 0
On the other hand, the “On Roaders” (idk what you call people who don’t off road) buying up all those SUVs allow [ Your Favorite Manufacturer Here ] to make money to create more of [ Your Favorite Car Here ].
So next time you see that mom getting out of a Land Cruiser at the supermarket with her 3 kids, be happy she bought one because it also allows yours to exist.
"HammerheadFistpunch" (hammerheadfistpunch)
04/26/2017 at 11:45, STARS: 0
What high performance off road suv paid for the land cruiser?
"Rico" (ricorich)
04/26/2017 at 11:49, STARS: 0
I’m strictly talking in the context of the conversation between you and PS9. If the SUVs are only sold to people who offroad and not people who don’t the sales would be in the tank.
"HammerheadFistpunch" (hammerheadfistpunch)
04/26/2017 at 11:58, STARS: 1
Oh I don’t care if someone buys an offroader to cruiser round town in (im looking for one myself for my wife) Im talking about using an offroad vehicle as a base for high performance.
"Vicente Esteve" (vicente-esteve)
04/26/2017 at 12:02, STARS: 0
ML55 tho
"Vicente Esteve" (vicente-esteve)
04/26/2017 at 12:03, STARS: 0
Again, living in a 3rd world country will make you appreciate them a lot more.
"HammerheadFistpunch" (hammerheadfistpunch)
04/26/2017 at 12:06, STARS: 2
Im pretty sure living in a 3rd world country would make me HATE them more. why would I want 20 inch wheels and 45 series tires and a high strung engine in the 3rd world? I don’t hate the G, I hate the AMG G
"Chan - Mid-engine with cabin fever" (superchan7)
04/26/2017 at 12:08, STARS: 1
I like the G-Wagen 4x4^2, but despise the G6x AMG.
"HammerheadFistpunch" (hammerheadfistpunch)
04/26/2017 at 12:10, STARS: 0
The 4x4 to the 2nd (stupiest name ever) is cool...ish...its at least enhancing the mission of the vehicle instead of doing an about face. Its still a little too “pissing contest” for my tastes.
"Rico" (ricorich)
04/26/2017 at 12:10, STARS: 0
Ahh okay I see, I misunderstood!
"HammerheadFistpunch" (hammerheadfistpunch)
04/26/2017 at 12:14, STARS: 1
A more appropriate person couldn’t have delivered this, as he doesn’t have to be...you know...right to be “right”
"Sampsonite24-Earth's Least Likeliest Hero" (sampsonite24)
04/26/2017 at 12:21, STARS: 2
as someone who loves the grand cherokee srt8 and the bmx x5M and SVT Lightning im going to tell you youre wrong
"awmaster10" (awmaster10)
04/26/2017 at 12:21, STARS: 0
Because its a comfortable, attractive, spacious, well built, and ridiculously reliable car that has the 3rd lowest depreciation rate of any vehicle. If it were built on a car platform but still had the same ride height the majority of buyers wouldnt care, BUT
It isnt that people arent using them to their full capability, its more that toyota keeps it on a truck frame so that the 5% of people DO take it off road will be loyal buyers because the BOF market is getting tiny. This also is important because if the 4runner went unibody and IRS, its resale value would no longer be exceptional, since 2nd and 3rd owners of 4runners sure as hell do need the offroad capability.
"HammerheadFistpunch" (hammerheadfistpunch)
04/26/2017 at 12:21, STARS: 0
Thats fine, I can’t handle your wrong opinion.
"awmaster10" (awmaster10)
04/26/2017 at 12:26, STARS: 0
Have you driven a fast x5, or a regular I6 x5 with a stick? They are incredible and have standard midsized SUV capacity. SRT8 I havent driven but seems to get great reviews. Granted, its an FCA product so 20% of owners have had nonstop issues from new.
"Vicente Esteve" (vicente-esteve)
04/26/2017 at 12:46, STARS: 0
You have a point, but even then they are more usable than low sedans with high strung engines and those tires.
"HammerheadFistpunch" (hammerheadfistpunch)
04/26/2017 at 13:26, STARS: 1
I like the X5, cause its a fast crossover, though I think the X5M is dumb because its just an okay crossover and okay performance car.
"HammerheadFistpunch" (hammerheadfistpunch)
04/26/2017 at 13:28, STARS: 0
So why would I want something that sucks on the available roads less than something else? For G63 money you could buy a G300 and a toy for the nice roads.
"DanimalHouse" (thrillerwa09)
04/26/2017 at 13:41, STARS: 0
Oh sure, let’s jam a more powerful engine into an already top-heavy, wobbly, numb chassis that can’t turn, break, or handle for beans.
No thanks. I’ll pass.
"Vicente Esteve" (vicente-esteve)
04/26/2017 at 16:39, STARS: 0
Oh yeah, as a value proposition they are woeful.
"Vicente Esteve" (vicente-esteve)
04/26/2017 at 16:39, STARS: 0
But, the sounds when you close the doors...
"DanimalHouse" (thrillerwa09)
04/26/2017 at 16:59, STARS: 1
To each his/her own :)
"Eric @ opposite-lock.com" (theyrerolling)
04/27/2017 at 12:40, STARS: 0
It’s because the 4Runner is one of the last two relatively-affordable body-on-frame vehicles that have a simple/reliable drivetrain and are easy to modify for off-road use. Everything else is a unibody crossover or expensive these days.
"Ash78, voting early and often" (ash78)
04/27/2017 at 12:47, STARS: 0
Sure, makes sense. I guess part of me just misses the $25k Xterra with no frills. Jeep basically owns that market with the 4-door Wrangler now. All I’m saying is that knowing BOF construction is relatively cheap, it still amazes me what a new 4Runner goes for when you consider that almost nobody buys them for capability.