by "Wobbles the Mind" (wobblesthemind)
Published 04/16/2017 at 22:30
by "Wobbles the Mind" (wobblesthemind)
Published 04/16/2017 at 22:30
Tags: Branding Games
STARS: 3
As some of you know I have been working out a system to explain prestige and product positions within the US car market. The new evolution of this system now uses 13 Market Levels for the US. I need to test this out, workout the kinks, then I can explain it all to you all, y’all. For right now though, give this a try:
Find your US Market Brand Position below:
*The stuff after the asterisks(*) are just thoughts for myself to help me work this stuff out. Also, I’m going to strictly define each of these levels after I make sure I’m on the right track.
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(No US Brands in this segment, only products)
*Now impossible to enter the US market at this level. Hyundai and Kia will be the last to go this approach with any success. Too low of a profit, too low of a brand value, and it destroys brand reputations. Better off just offering products in this space, never place the brand here.
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Chevrolet, Dodge, Ford, Honda, Hyundai, Kia, Mazda, Mitsubishi, Nissan, Subaru, Toyota, Volkswagen
*This is where all us
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Buick, Chrysler, FIAT, GMC, Jeep, MINI, RAM, smart
*Most top trims/flagships of Commodity brand products are here. Level 2, Level 7, and Level 11 are extremely interesting because they offer a huge variety and can contain your tuned/modified cars, independent projects, and specialty brands.
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Acura
*Buick-Avenir (potentially) and GMC-Denali (for sure) are in this level. I think Acura being alone in this segment makes it look bad. Rather than being viewed as its own thing it’s seen as underperforming. Because Level 2 is so diverse (can be done in your driveway) it’s really difficult to be viewed as interesting as well. Like the Economy segment, I think it’s best NOT to place your brand here.
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Genesis, Lincoln
*I think Dodge SRT has a much higher market position compared to any other Chrysler brand which would explain why it attempted a spin off. Dodge is dependant on SRT.
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Alfa Romeo, Cadillac, INFINITI, Jaguar, Volvo
*I think the difference between Level 5 and Level 6 is all perception. Freshness of product is the most important aspect which means extreme competition and effort.
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Audi, BMW, Mercedes, Lexus
*This one is difficult because BMW and Mercedes are working extremely hard to move their brands into a Level 7. Audi and Lexus had caught up to them branding wise for a while but are going to fall behind. By the time the US gets enough Audi Sport models (namely RS branded vehicles) they’ll be too late. Lexus F does not have enough value to move into a Level 7 currently. Cadillac V and Alfa QV both are on the border of Level 7 performance brands which is hard on Lexus since every luxury brand with slightly less current prestige (US wise) can beat them in pricing and brand value when utilizing their performance brands.
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Land Rover, Lotus, Maserati, Porsche, Tesla
*AMG, Audi Sport, and M are in this segment which is why they are being pushed so hard in order to move the parent brands further away from other Luxury competitors.
**Most of the track toy brands like Ariel, Morgan, or BAC can fall into this group. Independent and high level tuner vehicles can hold this kind of prestige out of the gate until proven otherwise.
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Aston Martin, Bentley
*Land Rover’s Range Rover brand carries so much prestige that it’s no wonder there are more of these in Land Rover’s lineup than actual Land Rovers. JLR SVO seems to be in this category too which helps out Jaguar models a lot but would only feel like a “trim” when attached to Range Rovers.
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Lamborghini, McLaren
*Ford GT actually has this level of prestige and I’m realizing Ford priced it correctly and is producing it the right way to keep that value. This is another rough place to be because, like Level 5 “Luxury” you need to keep freshness, but rather than needing new products you need constant special editions and updates.
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Ferrari, Rolls Royce
*This is an interesting point to get to because you no longer need to compete as much as “deliver an experience.” As long as you can deliver what everyone expects (or better yet, just slightly more) then you can really do things in your own time. Must be nice, but you absolutely must deliver that experience or else fall to Level 9 and have to work your tail off to get back to this golden resting place.
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Pagani
*A lot of these random, independant supercars can be placed here. Rimac, NIO, as well as crazy track specials like the Glickenhaus or Radical.
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Bugatti, Koenigsegg
*This is the edge of production cars can be. Pretty much the pinnacle of what can be done and only a select few will ever know it.
Hopefully you didnt the stuff in the asterisks or else you probably forgot that al you needed to do was find what level your brand was at. Now that you have your brand’s market level do the following for any of their models:
Subcompact: -2
Compact: -1
Coupe (2 or 4 door): 0
Executive: 0
Executive Coupe (2 or 4 door): +1
Sportscar: +1
Fullsize: +1
Supercar: +2
Limited Production Supercar and Hypercar: +3
So if you chose a Level 6 brand such as Mercedes and the CLA model, then the CLA is supposed to be a Level 4 product in the “Super Premium” segment.
***
Next, take that product and choose the trim level:
Base: -1
Midtrim: 0
Toptrim: +1
Performance trim: +2
Performance-Plus: +3
So your Level 4 CLA in base trim becomes a Level 3 product which places it in the “Premium” segment with middle of the road Acuras. That is a very big fall from a Level 6 Mercedes badge. However the CLA45 AMG would add two levels to the Level 4 CLA, placing it as a solid, full-blown Mercedes at a Level 6 product.
***
Give this a try so that I can work out the kinks and so forth. Then I’ll go on from there.
"G_Body_Man: Sponsored by the number 3" (gbodyman)
04/16/2017 at 22:40, STARS: 0
Let’s see. Mercedes SL65. Level 6 for the brand, +1 for the bodystyle, +3 for the trim. That makes an SL65 a Level 10 car. As much as I like it, I’m not so sure.
"Full of the sound of the Gran Fury, signifying nothing." (granfury)
04/16/2017 at 22:40, STARS: 0
Base model Mazda minivan? Can’t get much lower than that I suppose, and I don’t mind a bit. There may have been other trim levels, but the 6MT was worth more to me than anything else.
"OpposResidentLexusGuy - USE20, XF20, XU30 and Press Cars" (jakeauern)
04/16/2017 at 22:50, STARS: 0
I agree. I feel like the Performance Plus should be just Performance and kept at 2. It could easily be compared to a Mclaren but not a Ferrari
"Daily Drives a Dragon - One Last Lap" (ddadragon)
04/16/2017 at 22:51, STARS: 0
So am I interpreting this right? You have the brand number and then based on the car and the trim, you can go up or down the market?
I think this works, but also quality has to be in it too. I sat in a Panamera Turbo S, which should be a level 9 but I thought it was quite uncomfortable.
Also when adding and subtracting numbers, what if it falls off the scale either way by being too good (or exclusive for mere mortals) or being too crap?
"Wobbles the Mind" (wobblesthemind)
04/16/2017 at 22:54, STARS: 0
That means it equals the default of a Ferrari badge. Remember these are brand levels, the products can go past a level 12. Do a couple more (and Ill do the same) and we’ll make sure this is working.
"Wobbles the Mind" (wobblesthemind)
04/16/2017 at 23:00, STARS: 0
Cars that fall off may not be best for the US market (but great in others). I think some cars miss the goal, but we’ll need to find the levels in order to tell the true value.
"DC3 LS, will be perpetually replacing cars until the end of time" (dc3ls-)
04/16/2017 at 23:03, STARS: 0
I’m confused how to score the Integra. Acura so it starts off as a three. But would it count as a compact or a coupe? Then is the LS trim the “top trim” since it’s the highest non-performance trim?
Plus do 20 year old models even matter? :(
"Wobbles the Mind" (wobblesthemind)
04/16/2017 at 23:03, STARS: 0
I dont know, the only Ferrari that matches the SL65 is the California. That seems right to me.
"G_Body_Man: Sponsored by the number 3" (gbodyman)
04/16/2017 at 23:05, STARS: 0
I don’t think it could be compared to a McLaren, either. Also, it’s weird how a sense of prestige changes through generations. For a teenager like me, Benzes are still the big daddies of the luxury car arena, almost up there with Rolls. Most people my age rank Bentley higher than Rolls, Tesla and Porsche on par with Mercedes, Lamborghini above Ferrari, McLaren above Lamborghini, Volvo on par with BMW, Jaguar slightly above BMW and Audi, Land Rover slightly above Jaguar, Alfa above Jag but below Mercedes, Maserati on par with Ferrari, and Cadillac and Infiniti on par with Acura.
"Wobbles the Mind" (wobblesthemind)
04/16/2017 at 23:05, STARS: 0
You have to use current market. I cant figure out the brand value unless I know the market at the time.
"OpposResidentLexusGuy - USE20, XF20, XU30 and Press Cars" (jakeauern)
04/16/2017 at 23:09, STARS: 0
I guess I said Mclaren but really The their 8 is where I should have put it.
"G_Body_Man: Sponsored by the number 3" (gbodyman)
04/16/2017 at 23:11, STARS: 1
Also, see my reply to OpposResidentToyotaGuy about how perceptions of prestige change throughout the generations.
Most teenagers I know would make the following changes:
Lamborghini above Ferrari
McLaren either on par with or slightly above Lamborghini
Bentley above Rolls.
Tesla and Porsche on par with Mercedes.
Mercedes above Audi and BMW
Audi in Level 5
Alfa above BMW but below Mercedes
Maserati above Mercedes and on par with Ferrari.
Jaguar one class up/ on par with from BMW
Volvo is almost on par with BMW, that will get more equal as the new gen Volvo lineup is rolled out.
Cadillac and Infiniti either slightly above or on par with Acura.
"gin-san - shitpost specialist" (gin-san-)
04/16/2017 at 23:18, STARS: 0
I understand your system but think it’s mad. I guess that makes me mad, too.
I’ll play your game - Kia (Level 1) Forte5 (Compact, -1) SX (Performance Trim, one level down from the “Plus” which has more leather and shiny shit, +2).
So I have a Level 2 vehicle - I’d imagine pretty much all hot hatches are going to fall in here or Level 3 for top end trims.
"Wobbles the Mind" (wobblesthemind)
04/16/2017 at 23:28, STARS: 0
Yeah, its really rough seeing where brands are currently. It’s even weirder knowing how far some have bumped up or dropped and where some are going to be.
"GE90man" (ge90man)
04/16/2017 at 23:32, STARS: 0
The first car i thought of through the system was the Porsche 918. Porsche is a Level 7, Hyper car gives it a +3, and I suppose it would fall into performance plus, another +3, resulting in a total of 13.. am i doing this right?
"Wobbles the Mind" (wobblesthemind)
04/16/2017 at 23:45, STARS: 1
You got it, thats why its so valuable however, the P1 commands more and the LaFerrari even more. Chiron and Regera continue off. These are brand levels, products can far exceed the brand (Ford GT, Dodge SRT Viper ACR, etc.)
"Wobbles the Mind" (wobblesthemind)
04/16/2017 at 23:48, STARS: 0
Yep, a step above a commodity product, offers a bit more than the essentials.
"Mercedes Streeter" (smart)
04/16/2017 at 23:52, STARS: 0
Hmmm, let’s play!
I have two:
2012 smart passion. Level 2, -2 (subcompact), +0 (mid-trim) = 0 (Economy).
2016 smart edition #1. Level 2, -2 (subcompact), +3 (limited edition and performance trim*), = 3 (Premium)
That seems accurate.
*There were no options for actual limited edition cars, so I counted limited edition as a +1, then top trim as a +1, then performance trim since my car fits all three.
"Wobbles the Mind" (wobblesthemind)
04/17/2017 at 00:03, STARS: 0
It’s wonky for older years since a lot of brands have moved around. However it might tell you where the used value would fall compared to similar options from the same year. I’ll keep tweaking this because I think I’m on to something.
"SeeBeThreeFiftyFour" (seebethreefiftyfour)
04/17/2017 at 12:02, STARS: 1
Do you really think Hyundai and Kia will be the last Economy brands with any success? Sounds like a statement made in the 1980s if you swap in the Japanese. Would you not imagine seeing offerings from China in the future?
"Wobbles the Mind" (wobblesthemind)
04/17/2017 at 12:55, STARS: 0
They aren’t going to come into the market from the bottom, they are going to enter as premium brands, especially as “Tesla competitors.” No, you won’t be seeing any $12,000 small Chinese branded cars in the US. What you will see are opportunities to order a 400 hp electric midsize sedan or CUV for $37,000. “Cheap” EVs are very different from cheap cars and that’s the opening they’ll target and hopefully find success in. Otherwise, they’ll be like current Mitsubishi which is a difficult spot to be in as a new brand.
"Norton15890" (norton15890)
04/19/2017 at 14:18, STARS: 1
My car is: (Nissan Micra K13 South American version). Brand: Nissan: Comodity - Level 1. Definition of car: Subcompact: Level -2. Trim Level: Performance level (Seriously, Better engine than base standard, 3 models above base level and 2 above intermediate plus another one in the middle only with automatic): +2, still not top trim at all, doesnt matter, only auto. Total: 1-2+2=1 so: Nissan Micra K13 South American Version: would rate as a Level 1: Comodity category in the US Market. Yep, its MY2017 aswell. Just peculiarities in design and stuff.