by "Akio Ohtori - RIP Oppo" (akioohtori)
Published 03/18/2017 at 22:14
by "Akio Ohtori - RIP Oppo" (akioohtori)
Published 03/18/2017 at 22:14
Tags: Project Dumpster Fire
; everything that is wrong with
STARS: 6
So in my last posts I told the touching tale of how I may or may not have abandoned my formerly beloved Saab to rot outside for twelve years, but eventually got back. It took a lot of time, and I’ll be honest with you, a lot of money.
Like... seriously. A lot. I could have bought at least two good 900's for what I paid to get my broken one back. But whatever, it is MY Saab!
This morning I got a facebook notification from the local Saab group. They’re looking for final numbers for their spring drive, which is on April 8th.
Shit.
Ok... okokokokok. My initial plan with the Saab was to get it up and running by their Fall drive last year, but a tricky starter replacement had that date sailing by. Now I have three weeks to get this heap of junk capable of driving 120 miles.
Worth a shot... I guess....
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Contrary to everything I just said, there is a lot that is OK with the old guy. I’ve recently:
Replaced the clutch hydraulic hose (which was leaking)
3 of the 4 power windows are working and I have a replacement motor for the 4th
I’ve fixed all the fuel leaks
The injectors, fuel distributor, fuel regulator, and MAF all seem to be in working order
The starter and battery are in good shape
The parking brake works
I’ve recently shampooed the everything on the interior
The clutch is new
All 4 brakes are new
New plugs and wires
The turbo seems to be in good shape
No rust to speak of... somehow
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So, all that said... there is a lot that needs doing before it can be road worthy.
The driver’s side power window doesn’t work
The brakes don’t work and the (former) mechanic couldn’t get them figured out. Probably a leak somewhere?
The fuel pump leaks. Probably just needs a new gasket on the banjo fitting.
Needs new tires, obviously
The blower doesn’t work
The sunroof is stuck shut
The radio is shot and so are the speakers
The wipers are always on
The windshield desparatly needs to be replaced
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But the real problems are:
It won’t start and I have very little idea why. At this point it almost has to be an issue with the fuel system pressure. I have the gauge but haven’t checked yet.
Coolant keeps disappearing and going *somewhere* but I don’t know where. It isn’t on the ground or in the oil so.... mystery!
Brake fluid keeps disappearing and I don’t know where it is going. Same story as the coolant.
A lot of the wiring is VERY crispy and likely going to cause some issues.
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When I type it all out... it sounds pretty bad. Not like... Dave Tracy bad... but still pretty bad. If the starting issue turns out not to be fuel pressure, I think I’ll have no choice but to bring it to a shop.
Wish me luck!
"Dr. Zoidberg - RIP Oppo" (thetomselleck)
03/18/2017 at 22:16, STARS: 0
o_O
"jminer" (jminer)
03/18/2017 at 22:50, STARS: 1
Well good luck- that’s quite a list, but manageable.
I’ve never owned a swedish car, but worked on a couple Volvos, but you said there’s a Banjo fitting on the fuel system? I’ve never seen such a thing before.
Before you spend a ton of money on things like the tires and windshield make it run, then fix the brakes, then windshield and tires, That’s how I would handle it.
Does the engine have spark and compression? If so then it is almost certainly an issue with the fuel system. With it sitting for 12 years gas turns shit long before that, your tank and all fuel lines and components are likely full of junk. Make sure to drain all of the old gas out, blow out the lines with compressed air (from the engine into the tank) , replace all filters, fuel pump, plugs and maybe even injectors. I would assume the Saab has a plastic fuel tank so rust in there shouldn’t be an issue, you’ll want to change the fuel filter frequently for a while to make sure you catch all the junk from the tank before it hits your engine.
That’s how I would start, but I’m used to old carbureted trucks and motorcycles.
Well- my reply ended up being rather long winded- good luck though. If you’re anywhere near St Louis I’d offer a hand to take a close up look at one of these, I’ve contemplated picking one up in some of my deeper bouts of insanity :)
"gogmorgo - rowing gears in a Grand Cherokee" (gogmorgo)
03/18/2017 at 23:41, STARS: 2
Depending on how bad that banjo bolt gasket is, that could be a fuel pressure problem. Although you need completely shit fuel pressure for it to not start at all.
The brake fluid won’t be a significant leak except under braking where it’ll spray. Other than that there’s very little fluid in the system so it’s going to be hard to spot a puddle. Maybe try bleeding the brakes with some paper under the fuel lines. Brake fluid likes to absorb water so it probably rotted a pinhole through a line somewhere, which could be an easy fix or it could be a convoluted replacement of everything as you slowly destroy more and more components by disconnecting them for the first time ever as I did with my Niva.
The coolant likely is getting pushed out a small pinhole somewhere. If you can get it up to temperature it’ll become much more obvious.
Hopefully you’re somewhere you can find parts quickly, instead of having to wait several weeks for them to ship from Europe as I generally need to with the Niva. It’s incredibly annoying to be buttoning things up and realize you stressed that old corroded piece of aluminum slightly too much and now need to wait three weeks before you can put it back together. Last summer in my mad rush to get the Niva running before the Lemons Rally (it barely made it back together for the winter one) I actually started ordering doubles of every part and tossing in extras with every order in case the simple solution wasn’t the only part of the problem. I’m pretty sure I replaced my brake master cylinder unnecessarily but hell I wasn’t going to risk not getting everything I might possibly need...
"RacinBob" (racinbob)
03/19/2017 at 00:10, STARS: 1
We bought a SAAB 99 for ice racing that would not start for $200. It turned out to be a gas tank full of water. Check the obvious. Draining the tank and making sure there is good fuel is a easy start.
"RacinBob" (racinbob)
03/19/2017 at 00:14, STARS: 1
Ps, Crack the banjo fitting . If it sprays fuel when you try to start it, you have fuel pressure......
"DC3 LS, will be perpetually replacing cars until the end of time" (dc3ls-)
03/19/2017 at 03:03, STARS: 0
Idk about Swedish cars, but 90's Hondas have banjo bolts connecting to the fuel filter.
"Akio Ohtori - RIP Oppo" (akioohtori)
03/19/2017 at 10:48, STARS: 0
The plan is engine first, the rest later UNLESS I need to have it towed to a shop, in which case the appearance that it has been running would be... advantageous, if you catch my drift.
I should have covered that in the “what is right” section, but the fuel tank, fuel, fuel lines, and all that are new. I’ve checked flow to the injectors and it is good, as is the spray. We’re definitely getting out of basic troubleshooting territory and deep into the WTF.
"Akio Ohtori - RIP Oppo" (akioohtori)
03/19/2017 at 10:51, STARS: 1
Should have mentioned this is an 8-Valve turbo, not the more popular/ common 16-valve. That means I’m working with the joy that is Bosch CIS. My understanding is fuel pressure is everything in a CIS system, which is why I am leaning towards that being the problem.
The other options (in my mind) are bad mix or timing, but I feel like either of those should be close enough to at least get started...
"twochevrons" (twochevrons)
03/19/2017 at 11:13, STARS: 1
That is a wonderful story; it’s always nice to resurrect a car for sentimental reasons; I’m working on a highly-sentimental project car myself.
I haven’t had any experience with turbocharged CIS systems or Saabs, but a few years ago, I recommissioned a CIS-equipped VW Scirocco that had sat for a good twenty years, and had plenty of fuel system issues along the way. Here’s some unsolicited advice from my experiences, hope it helps!
If you’re getting spark and compression but still no start, the first things I’d look at would be the cold start injector (and the thermo-time switch controlling it), and, as you mentioned, the regulator. My Scirocco had problems with both – a bad cold start injector will make it nearly impossible to start, whereas with a bad regulator causing the mixture-control pressure to be out of whack, it’ll usually start and then die after a few seconds, or run really badly.
After I got the car running, I also had persistent fuel pressure issues, where it would run fine for a couple of hours, and then the pressure would drop down to nothing. It turned out that rust flakes in the tank had clogged the fuel filter, and were causing the fuel pump to overload. A replacement filter clogged within a few days, this time causing the pump to burn out, so I ended up having to replace the tank, as well as the fuel pump and filter. If you can get to the fuel level sender, pull it out and shine a light inside the tank – if you see rust flakes or goop from old fuel, replace it before you try to do anything with the fuel system.
Once you have confirmed good fuel pressure, I’d also pull the injectors and check the spray pattern – if you’re not getting an even cone-shaped spray, replace them.
"jminer" (jminer)
03/19/2017 at 12:13, STARS: 0
So do you have spark? It sounds like the fuel system is in fairly good shape. Does it cough and try to start at all or just turn over like nothing is happening, have you tried a shot of starting fluid?
"Akio Ohtori - RIP Oppo" (akioohtori)
03/19/2017 at 13:14, STARS: 0
Yes to spark. Working on an update, but looks like the line pressure is low. Not VERY low, but low. Adjusting the pressure relief valve and going from there.
Also have starting video.
"John" (vegandigitalnimad)
03/20/2017 at 05:39, STARS: 0
Have you checked that there is actually fuel in the tank? I would guess it’s an electric issue and not a fuel problem. I once had an 8v Saab that wouldn’t start and I replaced the distributor with a replacement and then it started right up.