by "PatBateman" (PatBateman)
Published 01/12/2017 at 10:30
by "PatBateman" (PatBateman)
Published 01/12/2017 at 10:30
Tags: Cheating Italians
STARS: 0
Looks like the Italians might have been messing around with their computers as well. More info will come out soon, so I wonder if they’re talking about the Cummins diesel trucks? Is the Ecodiesel not so Eco after all?
Expect this on the FP forthwith.
"Daily Drives a Dragon - One Last Lap" (ddadragon)
01/12/2017 at 10:32, STARS: 1
Because FCA didn’t have enough problems already.
"Supreme Chancellor and Glorious Leader SaveTheIntegras" (jegoingout)
01/12/2017 at 10:39, STARS: 0
We’re all cheaters
"PatBateman" (PatBateman)
01/12/2017 at 10:41, STARS: 0
What’s a few billion to them for the fix/fine?
"PatBateman" (PatBateman)
01/12/2017 at 10:41, STARS: 0
Speak for yourself. I’m a fine upstanding citizen/angel.
"Supreme Chancellor and Glorious Leader SaveTheIntegras" (jegoingout)
01/12/2017 at 10:43, STARS: 1
Wait till the EPA probe gets done with you
"Tripper" (tripe46)
01/12/2017 at 10:43, STARS: 2
No way, as soon as I heard about the VW scandal I thought, “welp, here comes the first of many.” If one is doing it, they’re all probably doing it.
"Future next gen S2000 owner" (future-next-gen-s2000-owner)
01/12/2017 at 10:47, STARS: 0
Harley Davidson did it, possibly FCA, rumors of MB and BMW at one point. I’m willing to bet all manufacturers use some sort of special calibration for EPA testing. Maybe not to the extreme that VW did but something.
It is already a well established fact that transmissions, engines, throttle response are all specifically calibrated to do well on mileage tests.
"Probenja" (probenja)
01/12/2017 at 10:48, STARS: 1
Mercedes-Benz, Honda, Mazda and Mitsubishi’s cars are shown to emit significantly more NOx pollution on the road than in regulatory tests.
“The issue is a systemic one” across the industry, said Nick Molden, whose company Emissions Analytics tested the cars. The Guardian revealed last week that diesel cars from
Renault, Nissan, Hyundai, Citroen, Fiat, Volvo and Jeep
all pumped out significantly more NOx in more realistic driving conditions. NOx pollution is at illegal levels in many parts of the UK and is believed to have caused many thousands of premature deaths and billions of pounds in health costs.
They all cheat.
"RutRut" (RDR)
01/12/2017 at 10:50, STARS: 0
The Ecodiesel isn’t a Cummins product.
"PatBateman" (PatBateman)
01/12/2017 at 11:02, STARS: 0
I know, I was just naming truck Diesel engines in the FCA Lineup.
"duurtlang" (duurtlang)
01/12/2017 at 11:13, STARS: 1
Everyone building modern diesel engines without large Adblue (or similar) tanks claiming they’re meeting NOx standards
in the real world
is lying. In Europe modern diesel cars emit far more NOx than modern diesel trucks (actual trucks, not pickup trucks). Not relative, but per distance. Which is absurd.
http://www.theicct.org/news/press-release-EU-NOx-emissions-HDV-LDV-comparison
In Europe, the average amount of nitrogen oxides (NO x ) present in exhaust emissions from modern diesel passenger cars is more than double the levels from modern trucks and buses, a new paper by the independent research organization International Council on Clean Transportation (ICCT) shows.
The difference is attributable in large part to differences in how light-duty and heavy-duty vehicle emissions are regulated, and the contrasting performance highlights the importance of an upcoming decision on strengthening the real-driving emissions (RDE) test for passenger cars in the EU.
(...)
“The simple average difference in NO x emissions per kilometer between light-duty and heavy-duty vehicles is startling enough,” said Rachel Muncrief, ICCT researcher and author of the paper. “But on a fuel-consumption basis, taking into account the higher engine-load demands for trucks and buses, the NO x emissions of diesel cars are 10 times higher than the corresponding measurement values for heavy-duty vehicles.”
(...)
Figure 1: Average real-world nitrogen oxides (NO x ) and carbon dioxide (CO 2 ) emissions of Euro V and Euro VI heavy-duty and Euro 6 light-duty vehicles under real-world driving conditions.
Figure 2: Average real-world nitrogen oxides (NO x ) of Euro V and Euro VI heavy-duty and Euro 5 and Euro 6 light-duty vehicles under real-world driving conditions (in g/km). For comparison, emissions of a Euro 6 gasoline passenger car.
http://www.theicct.org/nox-europe-hdv-ldv-comparison-jan2017
Why? Because (in Europe) trucks are tested in the real world and cars are tested in a very flawed way in a lab, with lots of legal loopholes. Cars aren’t even close to meeting the NOx standards in the real world in Europe, and when it comes to specific NOx standards alone the US has even more strict standards.
The question is, at least in Europe, if playing by the very flawed rules that have no basis in reality is actually cheating. VW cheated, all others misused loopholes at the very least. I haven’t heard of proof of any actual cheating beyond misusing loopholes though, with the exception of VW that is.
"RutRut" (RDR)
01/12/2017 at 11:13, STARS: 0
I know there was an issue a while back with Cummins relating to when they allowed a DPF regen to begin and that you could come up with a drive cycle where it never actually regens and lets particulate mass out.
"bob and john" (bobandjohn)
01/12/2017 at 11:15, STARS: 1
and now that someone else was caught cheating, I am willing to bet my motorcycle that they will not get anywhere NEAR the punishment VW got.
"PatBateman" (PatBateman)
01/12/2017 at 11:23, STARS: 0
I dunno. Depends on the severity of the infraction and how many vehicles are involved.
"Highlander-Datsuns are Forever" (jamesbowland)
01/12/2017 at 11:32, STARS: 1
I think this is why Chevy and Ford have DEF systems for NOX. They didn’t have the “magic” Cummins engines.
"wiffleballtony" (wiffleballtony)
01/12/2017 at 13:12, STARS: 0
Two Thirds of the Axis powers. I imagine that the Prius actually only runs on gas pumped from Indian burial sites.